Philip Pape: 0:08

Welcome to the Wits& Weights podcast, where we discuss getting strong and healthy with strength training and sustainable nutrition. I'm your host, Philip Pape. And in each episode, we examine strategies to help you achieve physical self mastery through a healthy skepticism of the fitness industry, and a commitment to consistent nutrition and training for sustainable results. Welcome to another episode of Wits & Weights, prepare yourself for some deep insights about entrepreneurship leadership, online coaching the fitness business mindset and more from today's special guests. Because I'm extremely excited to be joined by the amazing Lauren Ticknor. Lauren is ranked as Forbes magazine's number one business coach for 2021. And a Forbes top 10 entrepreneur in 2020. Lauren now works with her team at impact school to help her clients implement systems and gain freedom in their businesses. Lauren, it's great to connect, and have you on the show. Yeah, Phillip,

Lauren Tickner: 1:04

thank you so much for having me on. I know this is gonna be a load of value for your audience. So I'm gonna do my best to share as much as you want. Me too.

Philip Pape: 1:12

Yeah, but you're my audience and me as well. Here's when we connected. I was really excited to have you on, you have this passion energy, if anybody watches your videos on YouTube, or wherever else, as an entrepreneur through online coaching and fitness, especially business systems, and I know you're trying to impact as many lives as possible. So tell us a bit about your story from beginning as a content creator to an online fitness coach and influencer. And now a high impact business coach, what inspired you pursue the path you're on today?

Lauren Tickner: 1:41

Yeah, you've clearly done your research. So I appreciate that. And so it really started out I was just I loved fitness. I just absolutely loved it evidence based training and nutrition. And I was, I kind of started by accident when I was like 17 years old online coaching wasn't really a thing. But I found the likes of 3d MJ, and Eric Helms, and all these guys. And I just started reading the content they were putting out, and they had a podcast. And I remember they had a guy come on that they were doing some collab with. And he had a podcast, too. And his name was Luke Johnson. And they one time had this episode about how to start online coaching. And I thought, What is this online coaching thing. And so I listened to that, and became really good friends with the guys that are in that company. And we ended up just doing a bunch of stuff together in the space when it came to like training programs and ebooks, and this is back when you could sell 1000s of ebooks just through sending one email. It was craziness. And so I'm super grateful to have fallen into it. kind of by accident, honestly, I never intended to be in the fitness industry, I always had this goal of becoming the CEO of an asset management company in the UK, it was a weird goal. I know, looking back, it was so random. But I that's what I wanted to do. Then when I had that job, there was a gym like I was in a high rise building. And there was a gym just below and I could look down on out and see these people walking in and out all day. And I just dreamed to be able to go train whenever I wanted to. And so that's when I decided to leave the job. And pretty much then go full time into online fitness coaching. And yeah, then started working with companies like Jim shark and stuff. And then when they started pivoting more mainstream, they stopped working with a bunch of people they had been paying a monthly salary to. And loads of my friends no longer had an income. And I obviously had the online coaching the ebooks and stuff going on. So I helped them with that and didn't think anything of it. And then a couple of years later, I realized, wow, like this could be a really great business. And that's how impact school was formed very loosely. It definitely wasn't a company back then though. So that's kind of how we got here to this point. And I'm super grateful to be able to help the people that help the people because, you know, I know when I was first starting out, I knew nothing about business. So it's a it's really rewarding.

Philip Pape: 3:53

Yeah, no, I love that story. I mean, we listened to a lot of the same stuff. Apparently, you mentioned Eric Helms. And that's kind of how I got into this journey as well as a lot of the education and but I like how you said, you know, helping people, helping the people or helping people. And you sort of found your way there both through serendipity, but also through your own action to get there. And eventually, you know, life just throw you in the right spot. So for online nutrition coaches like myself and others who are just starting kind of back earlier in your journey, or they're growing your businesses, and they want to make that big impact. They want to help people eventually help people help people. What would you say just the core principles for finding success with online programs specifically?

Lauren Tickner: 4:33

For sure, yeah. So I really like to think about business in three pillars. So there's the impact offer, which is taking all of your knowledge, all of your experience and turning it into one scalable product, which is very difficult when when new because we want to help loads of different people and loads of different ways. But we're never able to build something sustainable, that's going to be independent without us having to run it all the time. If we try and do loads of different things. Because as soon as you start bringing on a team, they get really, really confused. So there's that part. And the second pillar is all about lead generation and sales. Okay? So I call this the specialist system, because it's a way to ensure that you have both inbound lead gen, and an outbound power prospecting, working for you all at the same time. So that you can also have a system so that anyone that comes into your ecosystem, you have a way to reach out to them in a stupid, non spammy way to get the conversation rolling, so that then you can prequalify people. And if I'm going too deep, just let me know. I love to go ahead. Okay, cool. I just don't want to lose anyone. But so you can pre qualify people and then vet them without even getting on to everyone seems to call it like a strategy session or something, you want to do that before to make sure that it is aligned, because I remember when I met when I was first starting out, so I was all about strength training, right, and about eating to become stronger. And this is what I loved. And I was obsessed with powerlifting. And I competed. And it was just the thing that I was really into, which was kind of weird, because like most girls weren't doing that. So I got a lot of girls come to me who were wanting to become strong and no longer have this like fat loss goal, right? Because my goal is they they were already super skinny, too skinny, right? And so they needed to gain some muscle. And so like, I remember then this one time, this guy could Steve came to me. And he was like, a skinny dude, right? And so he wanted to run marathons. And I thought, Oh, cool. Like, I can learn how to coach someone on a marathon like, yeah, it will help me diversify my skill set. And so I remember like, it was a Sunday, because I remember eating a roast dinner in England, you have like a Sunday versus like a traditional thing that you do in the UK. And so I sit down for this roast dinner with my family. And then I remember staying up until like, 11 at night, which you know, I'm kind of an early bird person. So it was really late for me trying to understand tapering and carb loading and how to, you know, run for a marathon, it was so boring, like, it was not like when I'm studying about how to back load your carbs, so that you can, you know, have increased, you know, whatever ever, like marginal gains for strength training, it wasn't like that, okay, this was boring for me. And I remember thinking to myself, Okay, but I need to learn this if I'm gonna be a successful online coach. And I had this belief in my mind that I had to know everything for everyone to serve every single person. And so around, I don't remember how long it was, because this is, gosh, this is years ago now. But let's just say I worked with him for a couple of months, and I ended up refunding him all the money, because every time it came to a consultation call with him, I just dreaded the encounter. Because it was boring, right. And most people are too afraid to say that they hate talking to a client, but it was true. And everyone has that client, they hate talking to you, they just wouldn't be honest about it. Let's be real. So what if you can have a business where you only work with clients that you love to talk to, when you get off your calls with them and you feel energized and excited to serve, right, because when you have that you want to show up every single day, and you're excited to scale the company rather than just grow it. Because you know that with more systems with more structure, with more infrastructure in place, you can then keep expanding the horizon rather than just growing something to its capacity, because you can't simply take on any more clients because you hate it so much. Right. And this is what I see a lot in online coaching people resenting their clients, obviously, we hear the stories because people tell us, because we are that guy to empower them to make it happen. But you know, coach to coach, people don't really tell this to each other that like, oh, yeah, everything's going great. We hear the truth most people hate the clients they work with. And this is terrible. So that's why it really comes down to like having one sustainable offering based upon the vision that you have the impact that you want to make, and then building the lead generation and the pre qualification systems in front of that, to ensure that you're only taken on the right clients that you can truly, truly help. And then from there, it comes down to the third pillar, which is scale your impact, which is replacing yourself. And these two things through building a team of purchased or building a team of special sales specialists who can enroll new clients ethically, and stick to your values. Right? So like, these are the three pillars that I always look towards. But it all starts with you, as the business owner, knowing where do I actually want to go? What impact do I want to make? Right? And why is that important? To me? Most people have a story. So Philip, I'd like to ask you like, what is your vision? Like? What's the impact that you're

Philip Pape: 9:25

putting on the spot? I was actually gonna ask you about that first pillar, right of the, of the offer of how do you actually determine that ideal client because I've worked with many different clients with different goals and your, your thing about the marathon runner resonated with me because one of my clients had done that and you're right, you had to just okay, a deer in the headlights. I don't know anything about that. I have to learn as much as I can about this, or you know, a lot of female fat loss clients or then I have the person that wants to build muscle. And I might enjoy working with three or four very different types of clients. So how do we how do we determine that At early on, to make that impact, right? I would love to work with three or four types in that group. How do we determine that?

Lauren Tickner: 10:08

Well, that's what you'd love to do. But it's not necessarily what's going to make the biggest impact. And sometimes we have to sacrifice our wants and our desires in favor of what the company needs, and what the people need. Because it's not all about you, in the, in the, like, in the long, long run, okay, at first, it's all about you when you know the impact that you want to make. Because when you get clear on the impact you want to make, it's like a tunnel vision thing. So a recent example, I have a lot of friends, and they are all investors, right? So they've got to the stage where they've built like nine and 10 figure companies, really successful people, like, you know, I can't even believe that these are my friends. But it's crazy. And so I did this exercise where I got really clear on what is my 10 year vision, like, what mission? Am I here to serve? Why am I doing this? And so, I would always say it's to build a company of companies that make a positive impact on the world. But I realized that's super vague, right? Because positive impact can be interpreted differently for everyone. Same like health, right? Health can be different for one person and the other, we know the state that we want to get to. But for someone with diabetes, it's very, very different than someone that is like, let's just say anorexic, it's totally different. They have to have a different treatment. So then when it comes down to the way that I was thinking, there are some things that are really important to me and some things that are not so I have a brother who's two years younger than me, however, his mental age is between one and two years old. Right? So he's physically disabled. He has epilepsy, and autism, various other learning disabilities, he has a tube in his tummy, because he does not eat or in a sustainable way. So he's actually interesting enough, quote, unquote, anorexic even though he would never even know what his body looks like. It's just totally out of his consciousness. Right? So anyway, I realized that for the longest time, I thought that the things that I really cared about was like education. And I thought that it was, you know, all these different things. But I realized, like, biggest, most important thing for me is health. So then, now, I had this deal come to me to invest in this company. And it was a really good deal. Okay, very, very good deal. It was a crypto gaming company. And it could have made a lot of money. And I know a lot of people that have made a lot of money from the steel. So I said to one of my friends who has a huge nutrition supplement company, like you would know exactly this company, like it's flipping huge. And he was the one that presented the deal to me. And I said to him, like, I'm facing an ethical dilemma right now. Like, I don't know what to do, because this deal is great. And I know I can make a lot of money. And I know where that money, I could then invest that into the things that I really, really care about. But it doesn't align with my values and my vision. So he said to me, something which I then ended up taking a different decision than what he said, Because he said, like, we'll learn if you put an even just, you know, X amount now, and you make this much on the back end is pretty much guaranteed, which, you know, this kind of sounds crazy sometimes. But there are these deals like when people play with like big sums of cash, like it can be like that. Anyways, I digress. But so he said, based upon what you're looking to do, and to achieve, like, if you invest the money, then that can be money, which you've then multiplied to then make a bigger impact. And I agreed with that. But it didn't just it didn't for me aligned, because it didn't agree with my truth value. So I said no to the deal. I didn't go ahead with it. And so now I'm very specific. And I could have made like, a really a lot. And so now I just realized, like, This feels good inside. This feels great inside. And it allows me to stay focused and not get distracted. Because I must say I did get distracted then. But now I know if a deal like that comes to me again, I'm not even going to entertain it. And instead I can focus on the things that I need to focus on. So I have to get clear on what is basically my tunnel, like what is yes. And what is no, if it's great. It's no it's not if it's not a Hell yeah, it's a no, I love that thing. And so, the same thing goes with like many clients that we have our impact school. So I have this fantastic fertility health doctor, that's her Instagram as well. And she in the beginning was like working with all different sorts of people. Like sometimes she would take up clients who were like, you know, half, half half, but then she realized like, why she's in the game. She wants to help people have a very healthy, successful pregnancy and raise incredible children. Right and so like, that's our mission, like that's why she's doing this. So if she's going to take on someone who needs to like reverse diabetes, that person will be better served with someone else who focuses on that specifically like another one of our clients, and M Charmaine Dominica as and she helps people reverse type two diabetes, right? And then for example, if someone with type one goes to her, then actually for example, the CEO of Impact school sister, her name is Gallia barrage, right. She helps she has type one diabetes, so she helps people who live with type one diabetes So there are people out there who you can build partnerships and relationships with, to send clients to, and maybe you want to do a deal where you send referrals. I personally just like to send it because you know, whatever you put out in the world as value, you get back 10 times, and it doesn't have to be from that same person. Sure, then that when it comes down to like the, you know, more spiritual stuff, but to answer your question, I think it all starts with you in your mind, but then realize that it's not all about you, and what you want to do, once you've made that decision, you then stick with your original choices. And obviously, you can change and adapt based upon new information that you get. That's, of course, important, but like taking on everything and trying to be everything for everyone, you're never going to serve people to the best degree possible. That's from my personal experience, having worked with, you know, more than 3000 clients very closely at this point. Yeah. And

Philip Pape: 15:47

I asked that question, especially on behalf of people who have have had maybe five clients, 10 clients, something like that, and they're still figuring it out? And really can't answer that question, I guess, is the problem. Some people have that, you know, extreme tunnel or target vision that they have others haven't discovered yet, like, in my case, I know, most of the clients that I enjoy working with, and I find I can help them most of the ones that found me through this podcast, or through the information I'm putting out there. And maybe there's some tie in to, you know, this, this evidence based nutrition and body composition that are really focused on a lot, but I'm not really 100% sure exactly where that falls, and I don't necessary want to rule things out either, if a new potential client comes in, and all of a sudden, it's a perfect fit. So that's why I asked that, you know,

Lauren Tickner: 16:32

one of your values, right, like, so a value that comes to my mind that you have clearly is like constant learning, right? And progression. So it's like you don't want clients who just want to get by, you want clients who want to get to that next level, because you then are able to thrive and you get excited to serve them, because they are excited about working with you. And they're excited about the outcome that you're going to get them. So like that would be a value that you have right for us. Same thing, we have constant progression. That's one of our values. That allows me to know our impact school, you know, if we're hiring someone, if they're complacent, and they're satisfied, and they don't really care to learn more than they're not going to be grateful at walking at impact school, neither are they going to be good at being a client of us. So that's just an example there. But okay, this is one thing that really helped me, I can't remember who said this to me, because I would love to be able to give the credit. I definitely didn't come up with this. But someone said to me, how do you want the world to look after you're done in it? So that was really helpful, because then it made me realize, like, there are some things that I just don't really care about actually doing that I'm doing right now. So that can get you thinking,

Philip Pape: 17:38

yeah, definitely gets me thinking in the audience thinking I hope. Okay, so what if your second pillar was about the developing the business with lead generation sales and so on, before you get to the scaling? Well, what if you love fitness? But you dread the idea of those things? Yeah, dread the idea of, quote unquote, business, right? Whether it's posting on social media, sales and marketing, all the things people think and know are required to grow business. And you're too I guess, too early on to necessarily hire and have a team to do that. So what is your take on that?

Lauren Tickner: 18:10

Well, maybe you don't need to have your own business. That's also an option, right? There's people like you, that these people can go and work for who already have a great platform and a brand. There's also other companies that you can go and work for. So I also used to be in the belief that everyone should have their own business. And I had a conversation with Nora, who she started out as a sales specialist, okay. Then she, this is years ago, then she started managing that team. Right? Then she started doing some coaching on sales for our clients. Then she started shifting into operations, and she became the operations manager. And now she's coo. And now she's also my business partner. Okay. And so like, this is the evolution there. But I didn't understand because she was making from in person personal training, she was selling it for 4.2k pounds. And every month, she was doing more than 16 grand a month, because I remember it was above 15k, but below 20. And then she I offered had this job and I said like, look, this is going to be a serious peeker. But I need you on my team. And she said yes, because she didn't want her in business. She She didn't care about the money as much. And so I think as entrepreneurs sometimes because we are so excited about things all the time, or we want to do 10 different things. Sometimes having those non entrepreneurial people on our team who are more level headed than us is very valuable, because they can prevent us from making all these crazy decisions, which, believe me, I've been there so maybe they don't need to have their own business, right? If you're on the PC, if you're a PC on the ground, like doing all these sessions in person and it's too much for you. Then maybe you could go and be an online coach for an online coaching company. If you're a nutritionist, oh, my gosh, there are that is like super in demand skill because there are so many great online fitness coaches who don't have a neutral Shouldn't brunch with a company. So they're just doing these kind of like sketchy, you know, macro plans, which they shouldn't really be doing whereby you could come in and partner with them, right? And then they take on all the business stuff. And then you act as the nutritionist at the business and get a fixed monthly retainer, or you aren't you say to them, like, hey, I want to be like intrapreneurial here, which is building kind of like an entrepreneurial company within a company. And then they build their own branch within another business. So that's also another option. There are many ways to do something doesn't just have to be like, Okay, I love fitness. I need to have my own business. Yeah. Right. That's what I thought. And so I even sunk more than 10k, this is 110 K, I did not have a lot of money, right? This is like, I was 19 years old, I invested 10k in building these leggings, getting them manufactured all this time and effort. And I realized, like I was just in a business idea, which was never even going to make any real money, right? People make money on that type of thing, because they have huge, huge volume rather than, you know, having something like a online coaching, which can be you know, high margin. So, to the point like, maybe you don't need a business.

Philip Pape: 21:09

Yeah, I think that's a fresh perspective. That's great, because I think, I think a lot of people answer that question with well, how do you how do you make it work anyway, and like you said, there are partnerships collaborations you can hire people you could work for people might be in sourcing and outsourcing, there's so many great approaches to this. Hey, this is Philip Pape. And if you feel like you've put in an effort to improve your health and fitness, but aren't getting results, I invite you to apply for a one on one coaching to make real progress and get the body you desire. We'll work together to figure out what's missing. So you can look better, perform better and feel better. Just go to wits, & weights.com/coaching, to learn about my program and apply today. Now back to the episode. So that's and that was the sort of leading to the third pillar than about scale, as I'm an engineer by background, so I love the idea of using repeatable systems and frameworks to make things more efficient. And I've done that well before I even knew what it was called right? Taking spreadsheets, automation tools, whatever. And trying to, because I'm lazy. That's what I like to tell people. I don't like to do things the hard way. I want to do it the easy way. Even with strength training, I was like, what's the lazy way to get strong and jacked? It's, it's barbells. You know, like, what's the most efficient? Yeah, right. I'm not gonna run on a treadmill every day. So, no. So yeah, so I think that I do have my podcast or posting on social or even the things I don't quote unquote, like myself when I mentioned the previous question about running a business. But I figured out a way to get me out of it, so to speak. Right, right, tell us about the value of that of systems of frameworks, how we amplify that fundamental approach to business or even life.

Lauren Tickner: 22:49

So I would say like, it kind of depends on on your revenue. Because I think the biggest problem is people do things they think they need to do. But they really don't need to be doing them posting on social media everyday. I used to believe this was a so we have this framework at impact school vile, right, vital, important luxury and eliminate. So most of the things are in that E bucket of eliminate, you can eliminate, probably, I love the 8020 principle. And then going even deeper on that there's this great book called like 8020, sales and marketing. That's a really good book. Okay, love this one. This is like the first business book I'd ever read in my life. And I still think back to it, because it just, man, it helped me so much. So there are so many things that we think we need to be doing, which really, they don't really produce any results. Like why bother building a website, when you don't yet have anyone clicking the link to go to your website? Right, only in the last three or four months did we actually properly put together a proper website for impact school before it was had Latin text on there? You know, it was terrible. It was really texting me. Yeah, and even now, it's like pretty mediocre. But we recently just I just invested in a website, building expert and copywriters to do the whole thing for me, which was a huge sum of money, which I didn't need to do. Because in the beginning stages, I would have been better off spending that I'm building a team to support my clients so that then I could get freed from that area, and then focus on sales and marketing myself. And then when I made that more money again, then I could then finally put that into, you know, maybe some ads or some social media growth. And then from there, maybe then you want to build the website. Okay. So like, I just think about things in sequential steps. So if I am going to have like two people visit my website, why build that instead, when I could build like an entire Google document or a notion page, telling exactly all the details about my offer, and my program, because then I can send that to people one on one in a DM conversation or via email who were actually coming to me and asking me or you could then start reach hanging out to like 50 people a day, saying and not doing it in a spammy way. Instead saying like, Hey, I've just graduated 10 People from My Nutrition Program, which reverses type two diabetes, just wondering, as I'm about to start a new cohort, if you know anyone that could be interested in, you know, reversing, reversing type two, right? That's just an example. And then you're going out asking them for value and then giving them value sorry, by seeing if they know anyone, and then you know, you can get referrals. And oftentimes those people then will end, you know, if you do your targeting properly, they are people that have type two diabetes as my example. And then from there, then they'll start replying back to you like, oh, well, I don't know anyone, but I'm interested, right? And then you can send that each of them directly in the chat. So it's just like the volume of people that will see it will be way greater than like, I'm giving this website example. Because this is probably the biggest mistake that I see. People get all their fancy business cards and things. No one cares.

Philip Pape: 25:57

Nobody, nobody sees it. Yeah, nobody comes. Yeah, exactly. So.

Lauren Tickner: 26:00

So before even thinking about scale, I like to scale intimacy, which is one on one conversations. And I like to get that so scaled that like, for example, as the business owner, I would no longer be able to do anymore, because I have other things going on. And then I would want to replace myself in the things that are not directly producing revenue. Because I think especially in fitness coaches think that they have to do all the client work, like, I don't want to have a cookie cutter program. And I don't want to, you know, I thought all this stuff, too. But then I realized I can hire great people, when I'm making enough sales, people who are really fantastic, who don't want their own business, who will come and work at my company, who are going to get better results for my clients, because I can then stay in my zone of genius. So it really comes down to at this point, like ask yourself the question, what do I hate doing the most of my business that doesn't produce me revenue? Excellent. Because if you hate your sales, like, you probably want to keep doing that for a while until you've refined it and dialed in the system so that every single time you know that this is going to produce the outcome that you want,

Philip Pape: 26:54

right? And I imagine everybody you can pick 100 people and every one of them are going to dislike a different aspect of that process. So you got to target the woman, you know, like, I really enjoyed talking with people, and I didn't used to, you know, years ago used to be very introverted. And, you know, now I'm talking probably way too much on my podcast. But yeah, that's my outlet for reaching. Yeah,

Lauren Tickner: 27:13

that's great. That's great. But if you were doing client work, like 10 hours a day, you wouldn't be able to do this right? And so like, it just comes down to also thinking where can I add leverage, and you know, a lot of it on the client success side of things, we like the impact offer, because it's really a fusion of having, you know, an out a program, which takes someone to an outcome specifically, but then there's enough like wiggle room so that throughout that process, you can adapt things, one on one to every single client. And especially now, like, the way that I'm seeing the industry go in, is that coaching plus consulting plus Courses Plus agency is all moving into the same umbrella. Right? So it's like, how can we do more for our clients, so that then they have to do less work so that we can stand out, rather than them saying, like, what makes you different than this person, right, that's also something that's going on in the space. So I think adding leverage through building a program, we like having an impact offer, because I just think it fuses together everything. So so nicely, client does something they submitted to you, it's all systematized and organized. And then from there, like most of the time, the next thing comes down to like getting someone to take care of actually managing the clients serving the clients. And then if they have like something specific that needs your attention, then that person will come to you to ask you rather than the client coming to you. And it just removes that level of access. So then you're able to have the creative thinking time to think how can I actually scale this thing? Right? How can I build a new system to bring in more leads of dream clients, or get me on more podcasts or go to more events, things like that, it creates that freedom, then you can really, really scale?

Philip Pape: 28:52

The impact offer, as opposed to trying to sell the differences between you as an individual coach, for example, it's having a program where the client feels like that it's seamless, maybe frictionless for them, and then being able to scale. So taking a step back a little bit for someone who wants to be that entrepreneur who does have the passion and enjoys the fitness space, but they have a full time job, right? They're already feeling a little bit stretched, thin, overwhelmed, maybe of the family and so on. And they want to cut through a lot of these shiny tools and distractions we've just been talking about, maybe they're a little risk averse to but still feel like that's the way they want to go where where would they start? Right balancing that job that they don't want to give up just yet. And then moving into this new venture?

Lauren Tickner: 29:33

Yeah, so it's interesting, we recently kind of pivoted to working exclusively with people that like, you know, full time in their business already doing like a certain amount because, you know, this is where I'd say we are the strongest when it comes to like getting the first and honestly it's the first stage like I don't even think it's a good idea for someone to like join a program like in post school at that stage. Because it is it's way more simple than people think is It's way more simple. And I don't feel super ethical doing that. Because like, it's so simple. And I didn't realize that it's mainly just you and yourself. So I would say the first thing is that you need to be dedicating like, one or two hours a day to personal development, you have to start that you have to get ready for it, you need an entrepreneurial mindset upgrade, so that then you're ready for what's about to come. Because when things start moving, they start moving very, very quickly. And people are often thinking like, it feels too much too soon. But that's entrepreneurship. Okay. So where can you right now, if you pull out your phone, pull out your calendar, whatever you like to use? Where can you put in, let's just say 30 to 30 minutes, lots of personal development work, and you put that in, right? And I'm not talking like, just business stuff here. I'm talking about personal development, things like you know, maybe you want to look at like Dr. John Demartini. Okay, like Bob Proctor, you know, people Tony Robbins people that are gonna show your mind, like what you can do, what you can take you to the next level, where you're listening to this podcast. Now, you could check out mine to impact school podcasts and things like this that you can listen to and make notes. Because you have to start getting into the habit of doing the things that other people won't do. Because in order to be successful in entrepreneurship, I've seen again, from our clients, our most successful clients, my friends, the ones that will Zig when everybody else thinks they're the ones that are gonna be the most successful, right? Like, you're probably already into fitness, and your friends aren't right. You're into health and fitness people from the past thought that you were crazy. Now all your friends are, you've made new friends who are fitness friends, right? I had that same thing too. So like, how did you get so good at health and fitness? Because you did what everyone else thought was weird, right? We are. Exactly. That's what I mean. Right? Everyone says that you have to do HIIT training, whereas you just, you know, squat every day. And that's how you make the games. Exactly. So. So that's the first thing. Second thing is like, really understanding that and answering that question like how do you want the world to look after you're done with it? I really love the sport because then it gives you clarity and direction. And when you have that clear, then you'll know Okay, let's say right now, if I were to tell you, you need to charge two grand for a client. If that makes you shudder. You know, you need to do money mindset work. Okay? There are some great books like Jensen Zehra has a book called you're a badass at making money. There's another book called The Richest Man in Babylon. Man, there's a lot but just on Google on Titan money mindset books, okay, you need to improve your money mindset. If you think that charging two grand is too low, I too high sorry, I think charging two grand is too low. Even if you're in health and fitness. Because let's be honest, if you're in the house, if you're in that industry, you could have 1000 wishes. But if you you know if you if you don't have your health, and you only have one wish, there's some quote that I heard a while ago. And so people have this huge mindset block here, I find this especially in health and fitness industries, it's a big problem. And so that's then something you need to work on. Okay? Then when you realize like, okay, I can charge for my first time round two grand in the future, let's say you want to charge for 5k, like a 16 week program. All right, then you need to figure out what's that program going to be, I have a video on YouTube, if you just type into if you go to my YouTube channel, it's just Lauren Ticknor. There's this video, like, where I spoke at this event called War Room. And it's like how to build a product or service and scale to millions, like that's the title of the video, like, this is a really good video to watch to get an understanding of how to actually, you know, have build your build your your product. And then from there, it comes down to just bringing in like five to five to 15 clients at that 2k price point. And let's say that takes you like, I don't know, 45 days to do, then you've made what, at least 10k in the very beginning. And it comes down to how you're positioning and enrolling people. I mean, I'm sure right now, you know, five people on your Facebook friend list or like in your small audience, if you have one, or your phone contacts that you could really help. So it comes down to positioning it like hey, like I'm bringing on my first five clients, like, I know you were looking to x y Zed XYZ? Would you be interested in working with me before I start charging full price in exchange for some feedback? And I'd be happy to get you in for less?

Philip Pape: 34:15

Yeah, this is gold. I mean, that's how I got my first clients as well. It's a great approach. You're right. And what was I gonna say here? So what are what are the things that then hold people back beyond? They got the mindset thing I like I like how you mentioned that spend time and personal development and it might be very different for different people might be how to talk people on a sales people on a sales call, right? Like maybe a lot of different skills. You You live in Dubai and we're talking and actually across the world right now as we record this, you have team members across something like 11 time zones, more than 15 countries. And let's say you are an entrepreneur and you've gotten through that first step, you've gotten 15 clients, your client base is growing. And now you need to hire that first person, coach, Assistant, build your team. How does a solo play exhibitioner start to do that.

Lauren Tickner: 35:02

This is great. So how not to do is find a friend and say, Hey, you want to come work? We've all made that mistake. So also another thing, a lot of people will find someone that's a friend as well and say, hey, look, let's do a partner business partnership. But oftentimes, like our friends are the ones that are the most similar to us. Thus, we do not need them there, because they're basically just you. Okay, so like, let's just say, Yeah, let's say like, you're a fitness person, and they are a nutritionist. And one of you is good at sales and marketing and one of you loves working with clients then great. But if you both a fitness, or if you're both nutritionists, and you both love to work with clients, and you both hate sales and marketing, you get on because of those things, usually. So in that case, you'd probably be better off just, you know, each building your own company, and then hiring your own teams, or just going into it knowing like we are going to we are very similarly, we need to hire different people into the business. And just be aware, like, you know, the partnership usually isn't necessary at that point, if you want to have a partnership, because you want to have, like the friend now with you, then yeah, sure, great, but just be aware, like it will probably cause friction in the future, if you're good at the same things, because you're going to want to do the same things. And the company doesn't always need that. So I would say it comes down to like, okay, you've got things going now just looking at your calendar, like what's taking the most of your time. And out of those things, like, let's say you would circle they will highlight things in green that bring in money, and then highlight the things and like orange that just allow the business to run, and then highlight the things in red that you do that like maybe you don't know, if they're actually doing anything to like, actually build the business. And then the things that are orange are the things that you hire. Makes sense, right? Because the red things, maybe they don't bring any money right now. But maybe you're like, you know, working on a new program that you're gonna change your entire industry with, right, and the things that bring in the money, you want to keep control over that. Because if you start handing over sales to someone else, and they suck, it's not that let's say you hire a commission, or any salesperson, and they just don't make sales. And let's say you're selling the thing for 2k. And they have five sales calls a day. Right? That's like, not that you're just oh, I didn't have to pay them because they you know, they didn't make any commission. No, that's 10k a day that you are missing out on, right that you could have otherwise have, you could have closed, right. So that's like how I like to do it. Honestly, I would say until, you know, 200 grand a month or so like being the main one during the sales is oftentimes the best thing for the business.

Philip Pape: 37:33

Okay, this is this is gold. I have a couple more questions, maybe from the client point of view. You know, I think there are a lot of salesy and authentic business owners out there that are scamming people, or at least perceived, you know, comes across that way, because the fitness industry is what it is. Nobody's surprised about that. But how does someone find someone they trust as a client, right? I'd like to think for example, we talked about this podcast that it helps people get to know me and realize I'm a human being, and I love this stuff. I like to help people. And so when they have that conversation, I'm sort of pre qualified them, as you mentioned earlier in a way that they know me, but for someone seeking coaching, how do they do this from an informed place?

Lauren Tickner: 38:14

Yeah, great question. I mean, I think what you're doing hence, fantastic. But I think it comes down to like, first of all, the business owner, knowing the ideal client, better than the ideal client even knows the ideal client. Because when you know, the problems that they have, before they've even seen those problems, yet, that's actually adding value, because you're highlighting the pains. So for example, like in the past, in fitness, I had this webinar, like, it was like, the three biggest mistakes. I forget the title now, but it was like, showing them the biggest mistakes that people make. And then they realize, like, Oh, I didn't even realize I was doing this wrong. And I added value to them through showing them that through, you know, constantly focusing on hitting like, one hour of cardio a day that was actually you know, preventing them from losing us from from from getting hurt, etc. And like getting, they always wanted to be toned. I don't like the word but they, you know, that was their favorite one. So, yeah, so that was really valuable to them. So I think making content surrounding those pain points and those problems, but then also like, as, as the client, like realizing that you just have to get started, right? It's like, if you've been thinking about it for a while, like, you know, if you want something now, the sooner you pounce on it, the sooner you start getting value from it, nothing is going to change, like nothing's gonna change, except your situation is gonna get worse. And so I think sometimes, like we have to really, you know, show the potential path of them not making a decision so that then the client actually knows that they need to make a decision right now. Because then when they come in, they're also a client that's bought in and they'll actually take the action. Right so I would say what you're doing with the podcast is fantastic. And also like yeah, built scaling the intimacy building personal relationships, like not being afraid to get in the DMS and have those conversations, because then you get the best feedback as well about what people's real pain points and problems are right now. So then you can build that into your solution.

Philip Pape: 40:11

For sure, yeah, and the cost of not changing is often much greater than the cost of change and trying to help people understand that. So kind of related to this on one of your Twitter posts, you talked about using the language your clients want to be spoken in. And I really liked that point, I'd like to learn a little more about that, if you can elaborate on it. Yeah, so

Lauren Tickner: 40:31

for example, like, if you say, I'm going to help you get a toned stomach, or I'm going to help you get shredded ABS is the same outcome is just one way you're talking to a dude that wants to, you know, get off. And the other way, you're talking to a woman who wants to have a nice stomach, or a guy that just wants to, you know, get a bit a bit a bit a little bit, you know, jacked and muscley, but not like shredded, right? So it really comes down to like, when you're in the DMS of people talking to them, or if you're talking on email, or you're looking at how they're commenting on on the posts of like, you know, companies in your space. Just look at how they're typing things, right? Like if they're like, yes, queen, like, you know, you want to start talking like that. Whereas if this became like a super scientific way, then you can meet them where they're at. And that's also going to kind of dictate, like the level of sophistication of the client in which you're serving, right? So if you're I made the huge mistake when I was in fitness, whereby I would be talking about super complex stuff in a really scientific way. And it totally alienated my dream client. They don't know they don't care, they don't understand. And that was, you know, I also when I was competing, I did some bodybuilding competitions, like bikini. And that was stupid. I shouldn't have done that. Like, I thought it would help my business, but it hurt my business a law and you know, I do, I just did it. Because my friend told me like, Hey, you should do it. And you know, I wasn't thinking properly. I mean, fine. In hindsight, whatever it was, it was whatever. But like, for my business, it was not good, because I was so alienating myself from my client. So that's also something to think about too, like, how can you be relatable, but also position yourself as the person that's been through the pains which they've been through? And now you have the answer in the outcome?

Philip Pape: 42:11

Got it. Awesome. Sunflower? Well, I like to finish with this question with all guests. And that is, what one question Did you wish I asked, and what is your answer?

Lauren Tickner: 42:21

Oh, man. Okay. So the question that you wish I'd asked, I think like, just maybe about, you know, for you and yourself, like what you need in order to get your business to the next level, like, because it sounds like you have a bunch of different offers going on right now. And you're trying to serve like a lot of different people. So maybe just something specific to that, because I think that can be helpful for your audience. And then maybe they can also send you in their feedback.

Philip Pape: 42:42

Should I ask you that question? All right, yeah.

Lauren Tickner: 42:46

I would say like, you know, you need to just figure out like the outcome that you want to take your clients to, and get ultra crystal clear on that, like, based upon the impact that you want to make. And then from there, I will also in order to get to that outcome, like have people DM you on Instagram, at Wits & Weights, tell them like, you know, what, what they're working towards? And like, what offer that you could put out that would get them to say yes,

Philip Pape: 43:10

I love that validation. Right? That's great. Okay, so Lauren, this has been an amazing conversation full of great information, I learned a lot. And if nothing else that I love that, but the listeners are going to as well. So where can they learn more about you and your work and impact impact school?

Lauren Tickner: 43:27

Yes, if you'd like podcasts impact school podcast, I also have a really old podcast where you can still listen to all of them, called Business meets fitness. So you might like that, that's all about like building a fitness business, like the stuffs super old from like, 2017. I think so. You know, I think it's still quite relevant. But I haven't listened to it for a while. So maybe my voice is a little higher. And I'm less eloquent. But yeah, that's the best faces and obviously, all social media. I'm on Facebook. We have a Facebook group called MP School, which is free. Yeah, those are the best places, Instagram to Lauren Techna. I'm kind of everywhere. So

Philip Pape: 44:04

awesome. Of course, ya know, and I'll include all of that. I'm gonna go check out that the older podcasts don't know which one you're talking about. So you've been an incredible guests, Lauren. And, you know, I think we're here we've peered into the mind of someone with a ton of experience and knowledge. I personally learned a ton I had fun chatting with you. And I want to thank you for coming on the show. Philip.

Lauren Tickner: 44:22

Thank you. This is awesome. And yeah, I love what you're doing. So keep it up.

Philip Pape: 44:25

Thank you. Thanks for listening to the show. Before you go, I have a quick favorite ask. If you enjoy the podcast, let me know by leaving a five star review in Apple podcasts and telling others about the show. Thanks again for joining me Philip Pape in this episode of Wits & Weights. I'll see you next time and stay strong.