Philip Pape: 0:08

Welcome to the Wits& Weights podcast, where we discuss getting strong and healthy with strength training and sustainable nutrition. I'm your host, Philip pape, and in each episode, we examine strategies to help you achieve physical self mastery through a healthy skepticism of the fitness industry, and a commitment to consistent nutrition and training for sustainable results. Welcome to another episode of Wits & Weights. I'm chatting today with Scott Friedman about the mindset side of health and fitness, which I think is underrated, but critical principle for success. Scott is a nationally accredited personal trainer, fitness nutrition coach and behavior change specialist who has been in the fitness industry for years. He's worked with hundreds of clients and specializes in mentoring them on how to build long term sustainable habits. Using his key principles of mindset, motion and momentum. Scott is a unique and engaging speaker, coach and host of the power of power of progress podcast, make sure to subscribe. He prides himself on understanding the needs of those who wish to change their lives. Through storytelling, personal experience, and a refreshingly honest take on the fitness and nutrition industry. Scott empowers and inspires his audiences and clients to take congruent action to achieve their goals. His authentic grip it and rip it style resonates with people and motivates them to take practical steps that improve their lives. Scott, man, thank you for coming on the show.

Scott Friedman: 1:35

Nah, man. Thank you for having me. I appreciate it.

Philip Pape: 1:38

Yeah, so we connected a little while back and we're doing a little podcast swap here. So today we're going to talk mindset and maybe some training and things like that. I just want to start with your background, right you have your podcast, the power of progress. You're also a public speaker, you're a coach or trainer. So what inspired you to get into the fitness industry and I do want to know about your grip it and rip it style.

Scott Friedman: 2:00

So I think it goes back. I don't want to go too long with it. But it goes back to junior year of high school. I was I've always been like this lanky kid my dad used to call me like Elmo, or like a Sesame Street character. My arms were so lanky, but there was like a good layer of muscle there. But I had like these lanky arms, and I was okay, fine. I'm a lanky kid, no big deal. But then, the winter of my sophomore year, actually, I started to notice I started to get a little bit of a gut. And it wasn't anything that I couldn't No you couldn't see like the skinny kids six pack anymore. It wasn't like a real estate spec. Like I was skinny so I could see it. I couldn't see it. I was like, Oh my gosh, like I need to like do something so I just I started drawing some sports. And from there you know when you join like the track team or whatever it is varsity track team. It's they start, they start making weightlifting. I've never with weightlifting before my entire life. I started doing it. And it was like the most embarrassing thing like when you first start with all these like seniors and you're like a sophomore, junior, they're like, lifted all this way. And I'm like, Okay, I don't know what I'm doing. But I kind of fell into it. So you know, I graduated high school, I started to get this routine going started going to the gym every day after school right before I graduate. My mom pushed me to do physical therapy is my major in college. And I'm like, Okay, I'll do physical therapy. They make good money, I think and I can say I'm a doctor, like that's what the parents want. I'll do all that two years in. I'm doing like organic chemistry and like, just biophysics. I'm like, I don't I don't like I don't care about I just want to like work out like I don't understand. So I found out I had no idea I found out that there was a kinesiology program, which I have no idea what that is. It's Exercise Science, which is basically personal training in a nutshell. And I'm like, I'll just switch to this. All the classes are super easy. And I'll just be a personal trainer. Like why not? That's what I want to do anyway. So I switch halfway through. It took a little longer to graduate, but I switched halfway through and when to Kinesiology. And I like to say as most of my classes, but I got into it. And really, that was kind of the start of it that kind of that three year period of like, you know, senior to sophomore in college, really where like, I really honed my love for working out and I think my freshman year of college where I moved to a brand new city, probably an hour away from home, but I lived in the dorms. And I broke my ankle in the first three weeks of school like do you I mean, imagine the you know, I live on the fifth floor of this 1940s building, no elevator, no air conditioning in the middle of August September in Chicago. So it's boiling hot. I live on the top bunk. I know one person and that's my roommate. He's the one who convinced me to go like a jerk. And broken ankle don't know anyone. So I'm sitting there every day I hobble crutches, on crutches in a boot and crutches. I hobbled a class and we have like this we had like a subway deli basically. So I ordered two sandwiches when I got home, one for lunch, one for dinner. And other than that I would literally just be at the gym every single day for like Two hours, mostly because it took me like, forever to walk around. Oh, it was like an hour of work. Yeah, but I couldn't. I had to hobble from each station set things up. And that was really it. I mean, that's when the routine clicked. That's I had nothing else to do but workout for like a year straight. Alright, maybe was like six months, whatever it is, but and that's really where it came from. I just loved how I felt loved how I looked, just to be as vain as possible. And that you know, and you're a college kid, like, that's what you love. And obviously, as I grew in the career, and as I kind of made it a career, you grow and you find out more about fitness than just lifting heavy weights a billion times to be as you know, jacked as possible. When you're in college,

Philip Pape: 5:36

of course, man. And you know, you mentioned the vanity thing, but it's kind of funny, because people don't care about vanity until they see that they get the results from this. And then they care about vanity you don't say like yes, because people can always listen to another show. And they were talking about how this guy lost a ton of weight and was able to nail everything down and improve his body for the first time in his entire 50 years of life in like six months, and you could do it that fast. And it was like, it drove him to do that. So that's okay, man. Right? I do what I do. I don't know if he didn't you answer the question or I didn't get it. But the grip it and rip it style. It's Oh, yeah. Yeah. So

Scott Friedman: 6:10

I've always been kind of a contrarian. When it came to school, especially in college mail, my instructor is so good example of fitness, we had this guy come in. And you know, we just had learned, you know, an hour a day before about how if you're overweight or obese, clinically speaking, like you shouldn't be doing probably essentially concentric lifting too much, because it could cause a heart attack because it reduces the blood vessels. And we load all this stuff. Okay, this guy comes in. And he comes in all professional owns a gym, very, you know, Suave talks to us, he starts talking how Oh, he doesn't care. You know, he doesn't do anything, any testing, any medical test, anything like that, he starts talking about oh, like, this is great. So I'm the guy. I'm the jerk, who basically is like, well, we just learned what you just said, will probably cause someone to have a heart attack without them consulting their doctor and making sure they're healthy enough to workout. So why would we want to do that? Why would we want to work for you, like in front of this guy. And so I was I was, I've always been this guy of like, I don't take what everyone says as like the gospel. And I've always, you know, when you pass the certification test when you do all these textbooks, and then I am so ready to go, I'm so ready to like be in fitness. And then you get into fitness. And you're like, This is nuts. Like what were you teaching

Philip Pape: 7:25

me for? Compute, right?

Scott Friedman: 7:28

It's like you wasted I wasted so much money. I tell people now in college like honestly, like just get the certification and get practical experience. Like don't waste time going to college because it's just it's just it's not the same. So my grip and rip it really came from I hate the idea of these, these suave people sitting on a pedestal, they know what their amazing corporate PowerPoint and you know, talking as if they you know, their doctorates, it's like most people communicate on like a seventh grade level, this is how we communicate. And that's how I communicate. I don't want to be bogged down in the nuances of Oh, make sure this is perfect. Make sure no, no, just just go and talk. And people will resonate with the message people can understand even if you miss speak, people understand what you're trying to say. And I wasn't when I was started the podcasting era of what I was doing a couple years ago. And my whole thing was, I am not going to do this. If I have to worry about lighting, if I have to worry about the best possible headset, the best possible microphone, the best possible backdrop, which I imagine, most people will tell me, Oh, you can improve this, you can improve that. I'm like, if I can't just talk into a microphone. And if I need to make all these outlines, I won't do it. So my whole goal was what if I do this and just just talk and just go at it. And you know, when I first got started, I was listening to a different podcast, who was very similar, who he was talking to microphone, no script, no nothing. And it was very authentic, transparent. And I thought that it resonated with me because I was like, that's how I talk. That's how I want people I don't want this. Well, today, what we're gonna do is just like, I don't need and that's not how fitness is fitness is very fluid. And fitness is very well, it depends. And it I think it goes in that organic nature of let's just have a conversation, we're gonna mess up, we're going to stutter, we're not going to be the perfect, you know, essence of speaking or whatever it might be. And that's kind of the grip and grip and I tell you how it is and not going to sugarcoat what can happen if you do it a certain way. And that's kind of where the grip and grip came from.

Philip Pape: 9:23

Cool. Yeah, that's so if I were to interpret it, that's that's kind of what I was getting from it. Of course, it's a deadlifting term, I think, right grip and grip it, but it comes across as like, you know, don't let perfection be the enemy of the good. Like, just take action don't We don't make make excuses, especially right. It's like, everything has to be set up just right. Of course. I'm very anal and very organized about things. So some of the podcast stuff does hit me a little bit right here because I do prepare but you know, we're all different right? That's the point. So all right, let's get into some of the mindset stuff then we're here to talk about you know, you have your key principles as part of your you know, who you are and how you talk through this. Have mindset, motion and momentum. And that first one being mindset. I don't know if it's intentionally first, but you know, it gives it a clue to how important it is. So most people have a goal, right? Most people have a specific goal. It's usually like, hey, I want to lose weight, I want to look good, I want to lose x pounds, I have a date that I need to hit for an event, whatever. What's your approach with a client comes in and says that? And maybe, maybe and you tell me maybe instead you want to focus them on the process or on the lifestyle changes before really trying to get to that goal, which may be months out?

Scott Friedman: 10:31

That's a great question. Because you have to, there's a balance when it comes to, you know, training clients, and I teach a bunch of new trainers now kind of how to find that balance. And when you're training, because they're paying you to get results at the end of the day, they're paying you to get results. So I think if someone were to come to me, and what I've done is I try to I try to I let them know number one that like, you know, here's what I'm looking at, right? I'm looking okay, like you're saying this, but what are your actions? Or what are your actions actually telling us? So I think there is a balance when someone comes to you, and you know that they're not ready, or you know, you want to talk about something else. But at the same time, you also need to show them they gotta get results because they're paying you especially if you're working in a practical sense, right? If you're working in a commercial gym, where you have a sales quarter, if you're working at a studio, if your job is to personal train, or even on your own, you're you're a contractor and you go to places or whatever it is, you got to get results, you have to be a good trainer. So you can't stop that and go Well, for the first six months. We're going to work on building this habit for and so yeah, it's kind of a mix, you incorporate things where you can, and then use your expertise and your knowledge. Okay, look, this is why this has happened. I have a client recently, who I've worked with him for over a year. And I don't think you'll listen to that. So it's okay, I could say

Philip Pape: 11:43

about clients all the time, just don't use their name,

Scott Friedman: 11:45

no name, but he he's he's had no nothing. Eating was horrible. Fitness is horrible. You know, of course, he wants to make the change. He's paying me good money to make the change. And we've got him finally in a good fitness routine. But his diet again, I don't wanna use the word diet necessarily. But for the sake of the argument, use the word diet is horrible. I mean, it's just it's absolute trash. It is though, it's probably one of the worst I've seen to be totally honest. And, but I can't, what am I going to do? Am I not going to train him so that we can focus, but he won't do that? So I have to find the compromise? Okay, where can I push him? Where can I not push him and get him results along the way. And eventually, what we've started to do was we've taken these mini steps. And like you said, kind of earlier, different verbiage. But progress is new perfection. So if someone wants to change their mindset, it's on me to know that and to basically create that adaptation. So what I started doing actually was instead of personal training, I focus more on coaching. And that's kind of where I differentiate because I felt when I was at a studio or I was at a commercial gym, I don't have time for that your trainer, right, you have 30 minutes, 45 minutes, you got to get them sweating, and gotta get them results. That's what you're getting paid for. You don't have a lot of time to talk about their mindset or talking about their habits. And so you have to work in those things when you're stretching them when you're doing these things. But it's important to realize, okay, how do I do that when I'm trying to personal train them, because if you can kind of find that balance, then they'll stay with, you know, they might not stay with you, because you'll learn a lot, but they will give you referrals, they'll love you, there's going to be a great experience for you. And the way I've done that, as I've transitioned from personal training to more of a coaching perspective, so I differentiate that between Okay, personal trainers more so kind of what traditional you work out with them, you know, weight sets

Philip Pape: 13:23

are just you're just holding their hand right there through them exactly.

Scott Friedman: 13:26

And coaching is I focus less on, I'm not going to hold your hand, I'm going to give you all the tools that you need, I'll give you the exact workout that you need. I'm not going to be there with you working out you're going to have to you know, I'll have the videos for you will have everything you need. But you got to learn it because if we're not going to learn it, then I'm not sure I can help you with the mindset part of it. So I've deviated from personal train directly to more of a coaching programming perspective. And both are needed. By the way, some people absolutely need personal training, they need that handheld, and some don't. And just depends on kind of who you're who you're talking to.

Philip Pape: 13:54

Yeah, it's kind of interesting to hear it from your perspective, because I come from the other side of it, the nutrition coaching side, and I'm trying to get more and more into working with people on their training, but without being a personal trainer, which is in being online, you know, it's like form checks, and here's your program, and now go and do your squats. And then the next day, I'm gonna have to fix all the bad squats you just did. And I can't do that in the moment, like a personal trainer can. So it's like you have to trust that they're gonna take that information, which means you have to communicate it really well. Yeah. Cool. So we just covered we just covered a lot about the fact I like the example you made about the six months like we can't work on something for six months before we get going. You wish you could write like you wish you could perfect be with a client for five years. And like just fix everything.

Scott Friedman: 14:40

Most people are like, you know, you'll get a client who let's say you're at the commercial gym or something. Oh, let's buy a 12 pack of 30 minute sessions. After four sessions. They're like why vet lost weight? I'm like, dude, like you're probably 50 years old or whatever. And like I'm trying to undo 50 years of crap that you've done to your body and like four sessions I got to so it takes time to investigate So it takes a lot of time to get those sustainable results. I just say you could probably starve someone quickly.

Philip Pape: 15:05

Yeah, of course. And that's the problem with their industry, right? There's so many people with the short term fix. And you have to package it in a different way and message in different way where they're still gonna stick with you. And I think your podcast and, you know, speaking to people and having them here and trust you and understand it's a long game goes a long way. But what would you how would you feel kind of going off the cuff on this? If somebody really, really needs a lot of work, okay. They're, you know, they're stressed by their job, they get five hours of sleep, they're not training consistently, they barely move, their diet is trash, like you said? Where do you start with that?

Scott Friedman: 15:41

You know, I think it has to be case by case I think you figure out where in behavioral change, you know, kind of stuff, you know, you have the pre contemplation and contemplation fields and the action fields. So you kind of figure out what stage they're in. And in each part of it if if the fitness is the easiest part, or if the nutritious easiest part, if someone comes to me and says, okay, oh, I love to cook. And I hate to workout, I may focus on the nutrition aspect, because I'm nutrition certified. So I can do that. But obviously not not with the arty stuff. But I may focus on that first. And so Okay, let's, let's make baby steps this way. Because, you know, we all know that nutrition is extraordinarily important. If not, you know, there's symbiotic but very, very important that it doesn't get the credit it deserves. So I probably focus on that. And they tell me that they hate cooking, they only eat out, but they don't, but they can probably schedule in time to work out, I may focus on the workout first. So I think it's a matter of progress is the new perfection of I can get them 1% better every time and just keep going and show them. Look, when we first started a month ago, here's where you're at, here's where you're at. Now, you might not see weight loss, necessarily, if that's the goal. But here's what you're doing. Like, look what you've done, you've done 12 workouts, you've done X, Y and Z, you built muscle here, like you're on the right path, that's gonna take time and, and calm. And I'm very transparent with that like, this is going to take time, like you're investing in the process, just like a job just like a relationship. This is no different than anything else, like you didn't start in a company at President, you started with minion, and you worked your way up to, you know, whatever director role that you might have, it's the same thing, your body's the same way you got to start from where you're at, and then work your way up. And then, you know, so on so forth. So it is very hard question. But the answer is, it depends based on kind of where their mindsets up, I wouldn't attack it all at once, I would go one at a time. Very small steps.

Philip Pape: 17:23

Yeah. And that's what I was getting from what you're saying is the small wins, it's like, a lot of people try to start from the biggest gap, maybe and try to fix that. And then it's very demotivating, when it takes time to kind of close that gap. Whereas you're saying, start from your strengths start from where you're close, but not quite there, and it's something you enjoy. And then you can get that quick win, right, and then spiral it into these other things. At least that's what I'm getting from what you're saying?

Scott Friedman: 17:48

Yeah, 100%. And again, maybe that's not you know, maybe some psychologists out there says no, start with a bigger win, because you hear all these different, but and there's nothing wrong with that. I just think that when you're building momentum, building that, you know, when after when progress after progress that builds your momentum, which then creates that snowball effect, okay, now you feel better when you first what I found, at least in my experience is when people first ask you, I want to lose weight, I want to do this, they're not understanding that this is a lifestyle change, versus something they're gonna do for six months, and then stop. What most people do is they think they're gonna say, Oh, what's that lose 40 pounds, I can go back to eating chocolate cake, I can go, it's like, no, no, this is your life now, like, this is what you have to do. So when you start getting these wins, and you start feeling better and better and better, and you start seeing it, that's a good way to build that mindset of okay, this is this feels good, I can do this. Because they don't, they don't know what that feels like until they start to feel it. So that's how I attack it of, let's get these again. However slow it is depends on the person. But let's get these small wins, build momentum. And then slowly this will change your mindset to in a year from now you will recognize yourself like oh my gosh, I work out I worked out three days a week for a year, and I never did that before. And those are small wins. And now it's part of your life part of your habit. And you're going to start seeing more and more results as you snowball again, the more you move, the more you do the the more results you're gonna get. So obviously the pressure

Philip Pape: 19:10

how fast you want to go. Yeah, I'm picking up what you're putting down man. And I think the people listening who just even when they're doing it on their own, you know, take heart if they if you feel like you're you've got a lot to work on and you've been going years doing one thing, just listen to what Scott saying Right? Attack Attack one behavior that is a small one and area that you enjoy, start to build on that. Because motivation, we know willpower motivation. They're nice in the short term for a little burst. Or even if you have a coach, it's nice to have that coach to push you but it's not a sustainable approach. And I know you'd like to talk about that too, right motivation and willpower. What? What's the alternative to that is that what we were just talking about is there's some other mindset games and strategies you bring into play.

Scott Friedman: 19:52

I think motivation is great to get started. There's no doubt like you're not going to do it. If you're not motivated. I'm awesome. You also won't do it if you don't want Do it. So yeah, to be motivated to some mistake motivation last about two weeks. And I say that because about it's like 80% of any health goal from New Year's ends in about two weeks. So by January 15, all the health goals are already over 80% are already over. So motivation doesn't last very long motivation doesn't last, when it's five in the morning, snowing cold in the Midwest and your car doesn't start, you're going to warm it up. That's that there's no motivation there. I think what helps, I guess there's two things, one discipline, I think discipline is really where people should be focused. And discipline is habit building, if you can do something over and over again, and build that habit built. There's something called basically neurological pathways where if you do something over and over again, repetition is how we learn, you're gonna build that muscle memory basically, in a more of a habit sense than the actual muscle memory. So I think that's number one is discipline, build discipline, focus on that focus on, you don't have to like what you're going to do. As long as you go and do it, I have the time. And this might be horrible to say, like, I don't want to work out half the time I had to be like, I'd be like, Okay, I'll just, I'll go do it like fine. And I feel phenomenal when I'm done. And that's a discipline versus if I didn't do it, because I wasn't motivated, I wouldn't do it. And I think that's a huge differential. So I do it even when I don't want to. So that's number one. And then, when it comes to trying to stay, I guess supporting yourself, I would say some tools that I will implement is number one, you know, what's your reason? Why? Why do you want to let's just say losing weight? Why do you want to lose weight? Seriously, like, what what is the reason you want to lose it? Don't, don't tell me tell yourself, what is it. And then once you find you should be able to write out 30 reasons. It can be family, it can be personal, it can be as vain as you want to be as long as it's important to you when I was 22. You know, years ago, being being having a six pack and being just the hottest guy around was a really important goal to me. Now, that has changed since then. But that wasn't important at the time, that would force me to go to the gym, because that's what I wanted. So whatever goal you have, I think that's really important to understanding your reason why, and then making it visible I think is super important. Because I have a whiteboard in my apartment, where I live. And I have specific goals and specific why's written down so that I look at every morning I can reaffirm, okay, I got to do this today, I got to do this today. Because if you don't, what's gonna happen, you're gonna wake up, do your normal routine, you're gonna forget all about it. You know, especially when work gets busy when children are sick. When you go to the soccer game, I have constant reminders is actually I learned this from Bob Proctor mash if you don't know who Bob Proctor is, but he's kind of like the personal development guru. And he actually just died last year. But he actually used to carry on a note card in his pocket and would write down his reasons why or his specific goal. And he wouldn't look at it, but he would know it was there. Every time he felt his pocket, it would remind him that's my goal. So if like for example, if your goal is to work out three days a week, and you have that in your pocket, and you feel it workout three this week, you'll you'll constantly be resetting your mind. So it's not necessarily a motivational tactic. It's more of a support system tactic. What's your reason why and then make it visible so you can constantly remind yourself to do something because I have clients all the time. They know, they know 100% I know I gotta go for a walk. I know I I can't eat this ravioli or whatever it is, that's leftover. I know. But they don't do it. And they don't do it. They don't reset themselves every day,

Philip Pape: 23:15

they just kind of melt. And there's always a reason right that they didn't do. Hey, this is Philip Pape. And if you feel like you've put in effort to improve your health and fitness, but aren't getting results, I invite you to apply for a one on one coaching to make real progress and get the body you desire. We'll work together to figure out what's missing so you can look better perform better and feel better. Just go to wits & weights.com/coaching to learn about my program and apply today. Now back to the episode. So I like that so the discipline and then the y but with the y with a card idea. Is that something you use with clients like concretely do you say hey, go do this like on the onboarding call let's write it down an index card or is there some strategies with them? Yeah, so

Scott Friedman: 23:59

I tried to again, I'm very can't force people to do stuff Yeah, yeah, so I give them I usually give them an options I see what sticks and what doesn't stick. But I tell them if you do everything I tell you to do you're gonna see better results if you don't do it. I can't I'm not gonna force you like you have to be able to do now it depends on the situation I try to enforce the best I can without being too pushy because if you push it too early, you know clients will they won't trust you so but I attempt Yeah, so that's something I do attempt to do. At minimum I say they have to have some sort of piece of paper on their desk or in their sink at their house so they can see everyday when they brush their teeth or something like that. They have a whiteboard yeah they have a whiteboard even better if they have an office if they have a somewhere that their spouse or friends can't see that their house or at work put it there but put it somewhere where it's personal to you. I wouldn't do on the computer mostly because they need to open your computer to see it's got to be visible right when you walk in the door. And that's where my whiteboard is. That's where the mirror is.

Philip Pape: 24:53

Yeah, yeah, we're like so inundated with our reminders and technology. We tend to ignore them anyway.

Scott Friedman: 24:59

Yeah, you can put on your phone Oh, but I'm not sure. Well, people are the first I've got put on your phone. That's the hard part. It's like, actually, and then are people actually going to follow? That

Philip Pape: 25:05

is the question because it's so funny how these old school tool tools can still be highly effective. Like, just literally just yesterday, I have a client who checks in with me, who tells me daily what's going on, because she's in a phase where like, we're trying to get through a trigger triggering an issue with her food. And now she's like, you know, I'm gonna go ahead and on an index card, right, like my couple guidelines that I have. And every time I go out this weekend, I'm just gonna bring it out. You know, I'm like, it reminds you that it's great, obviously, because, yeah, you know, it's just yeah, like you said, everybody's individual. And the communication style depends, like some clients really want tough love. And you could just, hey, you need to do this for me now. Because if not, you know, you're failing yourself. Blah, blah, blah, and others. It's like pussyfooting around it. Cool. So we talked about perception and mindset a little bit. And I mean, what about shifting mindset? There's another concept that I like to get into and learn more about, I want to, I want to hear your perspective on that. of, you know, the fixed growth versus growth mindset, or whatever school of thought you want to bring up in? You know, people's people's way of thinking can change over time. Right. So is there methodology you use there you talk to about that for shifting your mindset?

Scott Friedman: 26:16

Yeah, for sure. So I'll preface this, I'm not a psychologist. So you know,

Philip Pape: 26:19

obviously take what I say with a psychologist. You're not an RD? Okay. We established that. Yes. I don't take rd because then you're forced to give people meal plans.

Scott Friedman: 26:27

Yeah, I don't want to do that. So when people ask me all the time, I'm like, What do you mean give you here's like what I eat, but go figure it out. So shifting mindsets is so difficult, I will say, from someone who like, you know, there's plenty of things I'm going through right now. So one of my mind shifts, mind set shifts is I want to meditate every single day, or at least six days a week, I'm willing to give myself that one day off just if something happens. And I have not built that in I went like three months doing great. I took the summer off because I'm stupid, and then trying to get back into it. And so you know, shifting your mindset is very difficult at first in my mind, it can be very difficult to do because we are basically a computer program, we are hardly there are many things that we are taught when we were younger that we don't even know that we're doing now. So when you're there's something so there's certain if you look up brainwave activities, before you're seven years old, I think you're always in theta brainwave, which is basically, your subconscious brainwave, which is where you just literally just take all the information, and you absorb it all. And then you basically build this computer program in your head. And that's kind of how you perceive the world. And so even brothers who wouldn't say a household, they might get different stories, but having different interaction people, that's how they grew up differently, or they have the same story. And they grew up the same way. And that's how some people say, mage, different parts of the country, they, you know, there's different stories. So you're, you're almost hardwired to have a specific story. So if your story in your head tells you that you're not good enough, or you're not meant to be in shape, or you can't lose this weight, or it's just negative all the time, it could take a lot of work. And so shifting mindset, I think comes with a couple of different territories. And I probably won't hit every topic here, but one is you have to self reflect you have to really be a lot of people are honest with themselves when they come to trainers and like I want to lose weight. Oh, I'm doing so well. And then they like lie about half the stuff that they're not doing. It's like, oh, I didn't realize I had that chocolate, I didn't realize it's like, okay, so you're not really being totally honest with me about it. They're lying to themselves. They're lying to me. They allow themselves self deception that they think that they're in better shape or this food isn't as bad as they as it should be. Also, it's okay. Somebody wants really self reflection really understand and be honest with yourself and have a Have yourself a good cry, to be honest, because it's a good emotional release to what am I doing wrong? Like what what can I do to actually make a change my life, and then really feel that I think the two biggest things that changing your mindset, and I truly believe this is one emotion, you need to have emotion of the and two is direct thought with emotion. So if you want to lose weight, thinking about it, and having an emotion about it, are to combine things that will really help you push that forward. So for example, when I meditate, if there's something that I want, I know it sounds a little woowoo, but like, I will have a positive emotion towards what I want. And I will then force myself to basically have positive intent would be intent leads to action on it, which then yields different results, which will then yield the congruent results that I talked about over time. So when someone wants to change their mindset, it's all about I think, number one, creating positive intent with what they want to do. And then building building that discipline number two, it we talked about before, you have to kind of just push yourself to do it. And as you get those many successes, and you see the results, it's like okay, you know, your mindset will shift slowly. For example, when you're an employee, and you work for a company it's like my boss he doesn't understand anything that he sucks I hate you. We hear it all the time. So then I happen to be the boss in this situation. They don't get it. They're only looking at one cup of the situation that's their perspective. That's their mindset this one cup was that's that's their that's their that's their job title, that's the gym they manage, that's whatever. But as a manager, you have five cups you have to oversee, you see more of the bigger picture. And so when you be when you go from one cup to five cups, your perspective changes you, you see, oh, that's why my boss did that. Oh, that's why this happens. Oh, that's why the trainer told me to stop eating that, because I gained 50 pounds, when you can see the bigger picture. And you see, and you can only see the bigger picture. As you improve. As you open more doors. As you get more results, you start to you start to go, all the light goes on that stuff that makes sense. That's why it's so when you start seeing those little wins over and over again, you can start then basically changing your mindset that way. So once you can see more cups from the analogy, you can say, oh my gosh, that's why my boss did that he wasn't being a jerk. He just understood that that you know, this leads to this, this and this, versus my little cup. Like why can't you fill my cup all the way? Well, because I had to split it with five others. So it's a matter of perspective. And when you're able to start seeing results, I think your perspective can naturally change. Now again, I'm not a psychologist, not a perfect exam.

Philip Pape: 30:59

Oh, no, but you just connected like the whole arc of this conversation from something early was said I want to, I want to like let it percolate a bit because I like this. First of all, a wise man once said, positive thoughts don't work unless you feel it. The wise man was you because I got that, I think from your website. So it ties in or just say, but But earlier, we were talking about small wins. And that's how it's a quick way to start making progress. Almost almost under the radar, right? Like you don't even realize you're just doing this thing day to day is making progress. But then now you also said you can shift your mindset by getting the results which sounds chicken and egg, because you need to first get those results to then feel like you know the results from getting results. So I mean people listening to that, it's it's a profound thing. But it really is true, it's that you want something go and make these little changes, start to really acknowledge and feel and recognize and enjoy those results. And then it kind of iterates on itself. Hopefully we're not getting too philosophical. Scott, I love this stuff.

Scott Friedman: 31:57

I love it. I love it. And I just I find it to be the biggest issue people have is that, you know, I think the positive intent is so important. And I think there's a new studies out there right now, you know, talking about you know, stuff I won't get into of course, but neural creating new neurological pathways and the only way to rewire the what's the way to what's the way to fix your computer, it's to reset it right, it's to get rid of the documents, get rid of the files. So if you take that analogy, it's okay, if I have positive emotional attempts, what they're saying is you could enter a certain brainwave status or certain feeling the meditation and feeling and say, Okay, I'm going to do this, which will then create new systems in your body, which will then help you move along and create more results. And it's a it's a little woowoo it's a little like, yeah, it

Philip Pape: 32:41

takes I get it, there's a scientific aspect to it that I think makes a lot even even meditation and breathing and all that. Like I used to be very cynical about it. But Sam, there's science behind, you know, how we're wired and doing those things and how they change our brain and our physiology. So I like the bringing this stuff up. And hopefully people listening can go research, you know, the theta waves and all this stuff. Yeah.

Scott Friedman: 33:01

Yeah, I recommend what do i Oh, there's, there's so many of them out there. So I wouldn't recommend one of them. But just look up theta waves and all that stuff. And you know, brainwaves and changing habits. I think you'll find some good, interesting reason, just just a preference, just so everyone knows, like, you know, I'm the guy in you know, I was the fraternity president I was, you know, a big lifting guy. You know, I was a varsity athlete, I'm not this you know, I was never this meditation, yoga ever until, until like a year and a half ago and I started studying as a really looking at wow, this stuff is life changing. Because the way I was doing before wasn't working. And I was like, this is actually so I'm not that guy was really off since I was five years old. I've been in the forest and medicine so that's not me at all. I was very anti meditation for 10 years. Yeah, right now I'm like, I'm like breathing I Oh, I breathe and I sleep oh, I need to work out leave me alone. And then now it's like, okay, actually, there's a little bit more to it than I had initially anticipated. So, yeah, so

Philip Pape: 33:55

so people might be thinking then Okay, that's great. I want to start making all these changes. But there's a Winston Churchill quote I like and of course I wrote it specifically for this podcast and it's plans are of little importance, but planning is essential. Right? So when when we want to change these habits, should we have a plan like so we have this goal? We want to lose weight and like you said you need to go beyond that. Okay, why do you want to lose weight? Okay, I want to I want to look good okay, why do you want to look good? Okay, I want to feel great for this or whatever. How specific should our goals and plans be to kind of reverse engineer back to what habits we should change

Scott Friedman: 34:35

I think all the way as far as you can make it as far as you can make because the farther back you go so for example, if you wouldn't take that exact example you gave so I want to lose weight. Why? Because I have a history of health disease in my family. Okay, but why do you wanna lose all because my grandma or my mom died when I was young. What so why is that important? You because the way I and then as you get deeper into the whys, as you know, is anyone with kids would know they ask you why why, why why? As you get deeper, you You get more emotional, and the more emotional that you can get about why you're doing something, the percentage statistical likelihood of you to achieve that result is astronomically higher. So if you can get emotionally attached to it, that's why I said, Be honest with yourself and stuff, like, why do you want to do it? What's the actual reason why you want to lose 20 pounds cuz you don't have to lose 20 pounds, like live the way you want to live, like, I'm not out here trying to get everyone like, if you don't wanna lose 50 pounds, don't lose 50 pounds, I don't care, like I want the people who do care to to come to me. So I think that I think you should take all the way down. Now, if you're with a trainer, and they're trying to do that with you, like, obviously, you're, you're only gonna go so far, but I'm talking internally goes deep as you can go. Write down as many as those as you can. Because the more emotional connection you can have, the better results you can have. Because you're just want to support yourself, because now you feel that emotion. Now, I've had clients break down on a call with me crying, because we broke it down. And they really felt that spark of like, wow, I didn't realize what I was feeling this whole time. And now it's so clear, and now they have a clear path, or at least a more clear path forward to achieve their goals doesn't work every time. Of course not. But it's something that helps you along the way. Now, of course, I do want to preface that. I'm not saying you shouldn't just grip it and rip it in and work out even if you haven't identified all those things that you shouldn't let overthinking stop you from taking action either. So that's a big thing. I'm not saying you have to make this as perfect as but oh, just do it along the way. Do it along the way. Always reassess and just, you know, don't worry about the nuance of it just start going is kind of Yeah,

Philip Pape: 36:31

yeah, it's a fine balance. So like you said, it's a, you want to have an end goal. Do you want to have some steps along the way, but you also everyday things can change. So what you go go the flow and keep getting out there and take an action. Exactly. So coaches are for and that's it goes to the format. You were talking about the why and one of my clients said, you know, she wants to be devastatingly gorgeous. She'll know who it is when she she listen this. I said, Well, why do you want to be that? Well, really, because I'm gonna be a good role model for my kids. Okay, now we're getting a little bit more into what you really want. Yeah, it's like she's got a sense of humor.

Scott Friedman: 37:06

I love that devastatingly gorgeous me to see if she finds the secret. Let me know.

Philip Pape: 37:11

Exactly. Alright, so a little side tangent here is you're kind of a storyteller, and you do speaking engagements. And I mean, I personally have a passion for public speaking as a skill, because I used to be an introvert and it was something I had to get over and again, mindset shift, like, you know, used to be well, I can't do that what that guy is doing up on stage too. Like, I know, I can do that. Now. Let me get there. I'm curious what kind of speeches and seminars you do like what what topics what audiences just, you mind sharing a little about that about? Yeah,

Scott Friedman: 37:42

very similar to this, to be honest, like, just a little bit more in detail. And we go through practical steps. And like we go through more specific examples, get the audience involved. But a lot of it is really based on mindset and explaining the difference between discipline and motivation and explaining, I love talking about the basics of fitness. So I have presentations that are basically fitness one on one, literally, how do you get started from zero to like, just going to the gym and like what you have to do in between the most recent one I've been working on, and I haven't done it yet, but I'm going to do it is called the 10 Minute method. And it's basically how to how to basically see basketball, your fitness in 10 minutes. And the idea behind it is if you can master your mindset in 10 minutes, and it involves basically getting off the couch warming up and committing to the workout in a 10 minute span, you can then achieve all the fitness results you want. So I would say a lot of what we talked about today are very similar to the public speaking aspect of I know one of them was called the beads you have, which I spoke at North Carolina convention last year, actually, it was being virtual, but the idea behind beads you have was because you have to become the person. And then you can do things to have what you want. And most people have that the opposite. They're like, I'm gonna do this. So I can have this and then I'll become this person once I have it. And it's actually you have to reverse engineer it. That system doesn't work as we've seen it considering our society, at least in the US our society right now is it's not working with fitness. So you have to become that person, which most people don't want to do or don't understand. Yeah. And then so it's the B do have method was something I talked about is becoming that person who works out becoming that person does that. So those are some topics I've talked about.

Philip Pape: 39:23

That's another 10 minute methods that also related to the coaching calls you tend to do. Yeah, yeah. Okay. Just letting people know. And the beat you have it's funny I've I've interviewed a few people leading to this show. I don't think they're the episodes have come out yet. Of course they will once they see this show, but and it's like that common theme of I don't wanna say positive visualization. Again, that sounds like the the woowoo thing. But if you are somebody a year from now, now, then you're obviously not doing something that that person would do. Right? And that's kind of leading you to do Taking those actions, right? Like, it's almost like you were you've become, imagine if you become that person. And all of a sudden you were in a coma for a year, and you just stopped doing all the things that person would have been doing as part of their habits. Now, you just need to get back to that. It's like,

Scott Friedman: 40:12

Yeah, I mean, basically, it's good point. Yeah.

Philip Pape: 40:16

So the another question comes to mind then is mindset versus education, right? In your experience, talking to people in the seminars and talking to people in general? How many people just don't know things versus they know the things but need the mindset? Change?

Scott Friedman: 40:31

Man is good question. I would say, it's gotta be it's not 5050. But it's pretty close, I would probably say 60%. You know, the issue is a lot of people who don't have the right mindset also don't have the right education. So it's kind of a mix, I would say the people that can literally just make a change, and it's just all in their head is probably about 50 or 40%, I would say 40% of them, like they can do it. I would say 60% need education, they just and they think they know, but when you when you know, for example, you go really into fitness, right? It's okay. Well, if you want to do hypertrophy, and you want to get X amount, how much do you how many calories above your maintenance? Level d of d? How do you find your maintenance level? Calorie? How many reps? How would you rest time in between? And they don't quite know that they know how to work out a new team. The new one? The I call them the basic nuances, because those are simple to figure out. Yeah, I don't I don't get into like the I don't get into the real end of the nuances. Yeah, I don't get into that. I think that's a waste of most people's time in the general population. But I think that the basic nuances are very important. Most people have elicited that. Now, I would say in between those, some people, they can at least go to the gym and lift weights, and they just don't quite know exactly how to put it together. So that answers your question.

Philip Pape: 41:41

It does. And it's just I it's for selfish reasons. When I bring guys on this podcast, or ladies, it's I want to learn as much as I can to but hopefully listeners as well. Because, you know, we all have to put our reels out on Instagram. It's like, what do people really need? Do they need to shift their mindset? Do they need to know about macros, you know, or do they need to know about like, oh, what deficit to be at? Yeah, I know. Exactly. It's both. So thanks for letting me on that. All right. I actually do hear hear that. But it's just very subtle. i There's some construction going on with scotch right now. But we can't hear it.

Scott Friedman: 42:13

There's a there's a fire truck right next door. And I'm like, great guy.

Philip Pape: 42:17

That's what it is. It's the frequency of the siren. Yeah. All right. So the penultimate question I like to ask all guests is what one question. Did you wish I had asked him? What is your answer?

Scott Friedman: 42:28

I mean, I think you I think you covered it. I mean, you covered? I mean, I'm not sure there's a question I wished you as I think we had a really good conversation on the mindset, maybe, you know, the only thing I didn't really cover was perception, creating reality. I think that if you're someone who works in corporate America, in which the vast majority are just you have a stressful job, okay? Or you have kids or you have this, like it's, I call it the red light effect. Most of us I have it too. And I'm not better than anyone else. It's just that everyone has it. But it's about the awareness of having it when I'm going to work, okay. And there are 15 red lights, and I hit, you know, seven green lights, eight red lights, what do you tell everyone that came into work? I had every frickin red light. You never acknowledge the positives in your life. Now you'll acknowledge everyone else is positive, except for your own your friend got a promotion, great job, your friend got a girlfriend, great job, you gotta raise. It's not that big a deal? No, you always were so negative towards ourselves. And so that creates the reality we live in. Because the reality is, you just said you missed every light, which is all 15 lights, but in reality is you basically were half and half green, and red. And that's how most life is most of its law, the law of large numbers is half and half, it's usually kind of how it breaks out. So my, the idea is, your perception creates your reality, whether you think it's woowoo, or guru or whatever, and you don't like that stuff. Just think about if you're negative all the time, and you don't you hate your body, you don't want to work out, it's going to create a self fulfilling prophecy where you're going to rationalize, well, I can't work, I'm busy. That's what the excuses come from. I'm too busy. I had a stressful day at work. I hate this. I mean, it's like if you've I've had clients who have, you know, they're a single mother or single father, with three kids on varsity sports, they gotta, and they still beat me to the gym. So it's like, I don't even understand. I'm like, to me, it's like, I understand there's going to be times you're left with things gonna be difficult, but long term, like, if you have a negative perception, that's going to create a negative reality, and that's going to create that constant loop that you're going to be in. And then it's very difficult to break that cycle. So I think that's one thing people fall into is they're so hard on themselves, but yet everyone else gets all the praise, like praise yourself first, like praise yourself feel good about what you're doing, like, oh my god, that's so great. And, and I have a hard time I have a very hard time taking any sort of appreciate. Oh my god, it's gonna be okay. Yeah, cool. Thanks. I don't I love it, but I'm like, I can't show that. I love it. It's weird. So, praise yourself. Appreciate the small wins because you're perception creates your reality. And if you're always negative, you're always doubting yourself. And if you're the workout, just hate that. It's not going to be you're not going to like it, you should be enjoying the beliefs, not hating the process wouldn't say enjoying it, but you should not be hating the process. And you should really focus on spinning that negative. I'm not saying fake Pat, don't fake positivity. Because, you know, if you tell yourself, no, I'm in shape, I'm in shape. I'm in shape, and you're not like you're just lying to yourself, and you know, you're lying to yourself. But if you can acknowledge successes, acknowledge where you're at, and create that silver lining for yourself and how you're going to improve. It will change your life.

Philip Pape: 45:33

For sure. Yeah. And how I mean, so just maybe come up with every day or every week, what is one win for today? That happened to me, right, is that, you know, would you say that's an approach or you have other purchase?

Scott Friedman: 45:45

If you wake up every morning, what I do every morning, right now, at least I'm attempting to do every morning is a wake up, what is one thing that I'm grateful for, and it can be anything in your life. Now again, if you're going for a specific goal, it can be for a goal but anything in your life, what am I grateful for? It can be it can let in Not to disparage anyone who doesn't have something but like it can be I'm grateful for having all 10 fingers, because now I can button my shirt easily without having a system like that. As simple as that is no one thinks about that until something happens. So it can be as that you have lights that you if you live in the US who have power this winter versus in Europe where they might not have power this way. Like there's certain things you can be grateful for. That may change the narrative, if you're looking for some sort of win and your goal. Yeah, what did you do yesterday that you'd be proud of and be grateful for the next day or be grateful for that night before you go to bed? Either way, when you wake up, go to bed? Yeah, be grateful. If you're grateful for something or one acknowledgement of winning, that can help break the cycle for sure. Awesome.

Philip Pape: 46:35

Be grateful. Great way to end the podcast. I think last question would be then where can listeners learn about you and your work?

Scott Friedman: 46:42

Oh, my gosh, it's everywhere now. So the power of progress, iTunes, Spotify. Google, we'll find we'll find you somewhere. iTunes Spotify at power of progress on their Instagram, Scott Friedman. 24. And then the website I have is Scott speaks fitness.com those are those are probably the three main places people can and feel free to reach out. I'm always available. I answer every DM that comes my way assuming it's reasonable. And so I'm pretty pretty open with everyone.

Philip Pape: 47:09

Cool, everybody DM Scott right now. So his inbox gets flooded yet to be happy to help. I'll put those links in the show notes of the podcast, the website, Instagram listeners can find you. And again, Scott, thank you again, man. This is a really great talk. I had a lot of fun. Hope you did as well. Thanks for coming on. Oh,

Scott Friedman: 47:26

absolutely. I appreciate it. Thank you so much.

Philip Pape: 47:30

Thanks for listening to the show. Before you go, I have a quick favor to ask. If you enjoy the podcast, let me know by leaving a five star review in Apple podcasts and telling others about the show. Thanks again for joining me Philip Pape in this episode of Wits & Weights. I'll see you next time and stay strong.