Kelly Howard: 0:00

For me, like I've always said that my Northstar a couple of them. One of them is that I just want to feel as good as I possibly can as for as long as I possibly can. So I can do all the things that I love to do. And so it's just always looking for those things. It gets you excited.

Philip Pape: 0:17

Welcome to the Wits& Weights podcast. I'm your host, Philip pape, and this twice a week podcast is dedicated to helping you achieve physical self mastery by getting stronger. Optimizing your nutrition and upgrading your body composition will uncover science backed strategies for movement, metabolism, muscle and mindset with a skeptical eye on the fitness industry, so you can look and feel your absolute best. Let's dive right in. Wits& Weights community Welcome to another episode of the Wits & Weights podcast. My guest today is Kelly Howard, the fitness consistency expert with a touch of adventure and the author of fit, active and ageless for life. Kelly and I met through the world of podcasting she had me on her show fit is freedom. So make sure to subscribe to her podcast and get notified when that one comes out. And today we're diving into how the spirit of adventure can revitalize your fitness journey. You'll learn how to overcome common hurdles to staying consistent with your fitness goals. We'll explore the concepts of a fitness Northstar layered accountability and external versus internal motivation. Get ready to expand your comfort zone reignite your passion for fitness and embrace the sense of fun and adventure. for over 25 years Kelly has helped 1000s of women prioritize their fitness so they can feel great and have more fun. In the second half of life. She invites women to adventure out of their comfort zones by trying new experiences they may have only dreamt of her fit is Freedom podcast, coaching online courses and retreats change lives daily. And she currently calls Houston Texas home, but can often be found kayaking, rivers and traveling trails worldwide. Kelly, welcome to the show.

Kelly Howard: 1:59

Thank you. Thank you for having me. I'm so excited to be here.

Philip Pape: 2:02

I'm excited as well, I think we had a great conversation on your show. And I'm sure we will have another one today. I love your recurring theme of adventure in your work, fun and adventure. Let's just start right there. What does adventure mean to you? How do you weave that into the fabric of your fitness philosophy?

Kelly Howard: 2:18

Sure. So I have noticed that there's so few things that women in general, and guys to don't really have to look forward to when it comes to fitness. It's like the next number on the scale. And it's so boring. Like, no one gets excited about the number on the scale when it comes down, I guess they do and when it goes up, they're tragic. And so it's no fun. So I thought, how can we change this narrative? And I thought, you know, what gets me going in life is adventures and its interest can be anything, okay? Adventures don't have to be trekking the jungle, they can be taking the taking the kids to, you know, a new park, they can be adventurous can be anything. But it's something that gets you excited, something that piques your interest, something that you have to look forward to. And it just makes to me a huge difference. Yeah,

Philip Pape: 3:15

that makes a lot of sense. I mean, it really does. Because even when you do go after those boring goals, and they, they kind of go back and forth. It's like, what's next? You know, like, what? What do we push, and they're so fleeting, right? And we've heard the concept of enjoying the process or loving the process. But even the process itself can get a little mundane depending on what you're going after. So I know you're like a, you're a big fan of consistency and talking about how you can be more consistent. And that's one of the biggest struggles people say is I can't be consistent, and then it sounds like adventure can be a good way to get you on that path. What are the predominant reasons that people have a challenge with consistency? And then how does adventure come into that? Sure.

Kelly Howard: 3:58

So consistency is one of those things that it's it's kind of like a unicorn. And also like something that is, is so mundane, that is part of us, but we don't really realize it because a lot of times people think that when they have to be quote unquote, consistent, it has to be big stuff. Right? Like, you know, the big workouts, the big goals, you know, all the big things. And so often what's very simple is that if we make it small, and that 1% A day kind of thing, it gets so much simpler and easier. So consistency. One thing people will say to me is, well, I'm not motivated, right? Consistency comes from motivation. Consistency actually doesn't come from motivation and motivation. We can talk about that if we want but consistency really comes from those little bitty routines. I'm not a big fan. You know, habits are a nice thing, but I'm not a big fan of the word habit. Because habit is it's a scary word, right? It's like oh, Oh gosh, I gotta change my habits. But if we just make these small little routines that we add in on a daily basis, and we find all the things that we need to do that will help it. Because there's so many pieces to it, right? Like you mentioned layered accountability, there's accountability, there's motivation. There's, you know, that Northstar of adventure. Those are all routines that allow us to become more consistent. So consistency itself, in the end, is nothing more than taking the right step every day, as small as it needs to be. Yeah,

Philip Pape: 5:34

I love that approach. Right. Just recently, I was listening to someone talk about how habits, the H word that we don't like, we often make them big and complex, right? Like, okay, I want to get 10,000 steps a day. And when you're getting three, we'll go from three to 10. And think of that as a single step can be a big problem for people, because what does it take to get to 10? You don't just set a number and get the number, right. You have to now? Yeah, I need to incorporate a walk here. I need to change something here. I need to do this. And those are all maybe the little things that you're talking about that are individually achievable, right?

Kelly Howard: 6:09

Yeah, it's such a good way to put it because we do we pick these arbitrary numbers that I don't know, we just make up like 10,000. I looked that up one day, I thought, why can't acid and although all I could find is that it was something that came from an arbitrary number that someone else made up and said, this is you know, the number of steps you should do every day. I couldn't find anything on there that said, this is you know, this is the number that's going to make us healthy. So a lot of these things are just like these arbitrary numbers we come up with, and then we think we have to do them. When in fact, if we just like, follow it, our body says, some days we push harder, so much easier. Yeah. The

Philip Pape: 6:57

10,000 steps. It's funny, just like less than a month ago, I think I found a source for that. It was like a Japanese pedometer company in the 70s or 80s. And they actually called it like the 10,000, the 10,000 step meter or something. Anyway. Is that cool? Yeah. totally arbitrary. It might have been might have been an atom Bernstein's book you mentioned I'm not sure. But anyway, back to the consistency thing. One other related theme to that is, I think I saw an infographic recently and put it nicely where there were seven days, right, each day was a circle, and some days are fuller than others on that circle, right? And the idea that progress can be measured in different ways. That doesn't mean doing everything every day, or being successful with everything every day. What are your thoughts on that as well, they probably come in many forms. That's

Kelly Howard: 7:45

the Okay, that's a big one for me. Like, I think that like one of the things that I suggest to people and I don't have a lot of shoulds. But this is pretty much a should, you should create a schedule every week. Because we both know this, when you have a schedule. It's real. Right? When you people will come to me, and they'll be like, Oh, I think I'm going to do three workouts this week and maybe a couple of hikes. I'm like, great. And when are you going to do that? Well, I don't know yet. So let's not do that. Let's

Philip Pape: 8:15

let's figure it out by one day or exactly.

Kelly Howard: 8:18

And so when you look at that, and you create that schedule, the next piece of it is that I like to go, can you hit 80% of it. 80% of it sounds kind of like I don't know, like you're not trying hard enough. But life happens. And if you can hit 80% of that whole week, all the circles 80% of them, then you're doing great, you can hit 90% You're like a rockstar. If you're hitting 100% You're probably not trying hard enough.

Philip Pape: 8:49

Or your circles not big enough. I love the 80% too, because it I don't know if it has to do with like the golden ratio. There's something that humans are attracted to it that 8020 We see it in the Pareto Principle, right 20% of the effort gives you a percent the results. But I've heard that a lot. And it's probably comes down to the fact that most people are trying for 100% and falling falling away. We were short, and then it's this chasm of all or nothing. But I want to talk about your fitness Northstar for for a second, because I don't know what it is. First of all, you could tell us what it is. And it sounds well. Northstar to me sounds like having having a competence having a deeper purpose or meaning, you know, behind something that's driving you. What is it and how can someone find this Northstar?

Kelly Howard: 9:36

Ya know, it's it's a little bit about what we talked about in the beginning. And one of one of the North Stars could be an adventure. But really what a North Star is, is it's finding that thing that gives you more purpose than just the way you look. Right like or just the way the cow just with the capricious scale. says, right? You never know like, what's gonna happen in the bathroom on the scale. So what a Northstar is is I thought, you know, what is the thing that really gets us going? And I'll give you a if you don't mind, I'm gonna tell you a quick story. This is somebody who came to me about a month ago. And she said to me, she said, I said, Why are you here? Why don't we want to work together? She said, I need to lose 20 pounds. Great. Why? She said, Well, my daughter's getting married. Okay, so why do you need to lose 20 pounds for that? Well, I gotta get into the dress. Okay, why? And you just keep asking that way. We know this one, right? We know that if you ask the why enough, you're gonna get to that point. And we got to that point, because all of a sudden, she said, Well, I don't look like I used to. And I don't feel like I used to. And I said, why? And so that's when, you know, her eyes got a little shiny. And she said, she said, Well, I just haven't felt good in years. I said, Okay, so what's it really about? She said, what it's really about is, I'm afraid of the next 50 years, or 40 years, or what I have. And I don't know what to do. I was like, Well, that's easy, right? Really, when you get to that point, you're really finding a Northstar. Because for her, what it ended up being was, she wanted to be there. For those grandkids, she always wanted to be like, you know, deep down inside, she wanted to be that cool grandmother, and the one that took them kayaking, and took them on trips and things like that, like those were all of that wants, but she was unwilling to admit it. Because she thought that, that life had passed her by too quick. And so when we pulled out the North Star that, you know, these are all the things that are gonna make your life shine. It changed everything. Like, yeah, it was she went, she's she's gonna looking great, right? She's already looking great. She because she hadn't, you know, you know, that plateau. She hadn't hit that plateau yet. So she's losing weight, and she's gaining muscle and she's having a good time. But at the same time, the end is going to be so much different for Yeah, and for me, like I've always said that, my Northstar, a couple of them. One of them is that I just want to feel as good as I possibly can as for as long as I possibly can. So I can do all the things that I love to do. Yeah. And so it's just always looking for those things that gets you excited. Yeah.

Philip Pape: 12:27

And you said something there that she's that after she was after she started to make progress. She said it's going to be different. In other words, the the satisfaction she gets from that is going to be more long lasting, because it tied to the thing she really wanted. Exactly, even though it also satisfies these other superficial things that we all think we want. Right? Interesting. Yeah. Yeah. And this why approach? So I mean, you know, I've heard that before, obviously use it with clients as well. Like why why why is it Is it as simple as that it may be right. Like I think sometimes we overcomplicate it, but people listening who just want to do this for themselves with a piece of paper right now? Did they just need to ask themselves why? And keep going down that path?

Kelly Howard: 13:06

I think so. Okay. And there's one more piece to it, though is they have to be honest,

Philip Pape: 13:11

honest with yourself. We lie to ourselves. I mean,

Kelly Howard: 13:15

I'm good at asking questions that I'm really good at watching reactions with people, sometimes for people. When we get to a stage where we're where we're uncomfortable, we don't want to keep going. I just came back from a trip in Costa Rica had a group of women there, it was much more adventurous than I had anticipated. And one of the things I was talking to one of the women yesterday, we had a we had a little incident in a river, where we ended up getting our raft, stuck, gets rocking, it was sinking. And we had to get everybody off the raft, and bring in another raft. And she was unstable, not flexible, and didn't have the strength that she really needed. And she looked at me right in the face yesterday, and she went, I have my why. She said, I want to be able to crawl up on a boulder in the middle of a river and stand up and not be terrified. And there you go.

Philip Pape: 14:16

It's so true. And I love that example. Because it's not it doesn't always it's not always easy. I'll say to find it. If you're just in a random moment, try to figure out right, like, it might come to you. Or you might even start to go toward one purpose, and then it can evolve, right, you can evolve Exactly. That think about moving the raft. It's funny, because years ago, not too many years ago, we had moved to our new house and my wife wanted a garden. And so I said, Well, we have all these tree trunks that were felled nearby. Why don't we just move them over? And I'm there and I'm like, Alright, here we go. deadlift that thing up and I'm like, I would not have been able to lift this a year earlier. Like that is so cool to be able to you know, your I could support my wife and I able to garden right? It's like little things like that make you appreciate life. So okay, that's, that's awesome. So now we know the Northstar is the deep purpose it can, it can be crafted through exercise through practice and exercise, or it can come to you with with these practices. There's also the accountability piece you mentioned earlier. And we understand how important this is to supporting someone, right? And even teaching people to hold themselves accountable through those daily practices you mentioned. But you talk about layered accountability. So can you explain what that is? So

Kelly Howard: 15:32

with accountability, in the end, my end goal is for people to be 100% accountable to themselves. Like that's, that's it, right? If you can be 100% accountable to yourself, and you've just, you've just won, you've won the fitness lottery. But to get there, most of us have never had that kind of support. So I think of it as like a pyramid. So you start with the very, very bottom, and the very bottom of that layer of accountability is something simple. So first, accountability buddies are nice, but you need to know the ones not to use. There's the big bad three is what I consider. One of them is your best friend. Your best friend's job is to make you happy. It's not to keep you keep you on track. You know, when you're when you're in accountability. I have a very good friend, she does this to me every year. She's like, Would you be my accountability, buddy, and I'm like, Oh, gosh. And you know, the texts are flying. And then they start petering off. And then I'm like, how you doing? Yep, you meet. And you know, she's like radio silence because she can get away with it. Best friends know, life partners know, they know every thing, every button to push to get you on the on the couch with the remote control, watching Netflix and eating pizza. Like that's their job, because most of them usually don't want to do what you're asking them to do. And then apps, a lot of people depend on, you know, different phone apps to keep them in line. So I can work. But that can be like, start one that can be layer one issues in an app. Because you know, it works. So then you then you come up and you step in and you're like, what's next layer? Next layer for different people could be different things, one of them might be signing up for something that is a goal of 5k, an adventure trip, or wedding, whatever it is, right?

Philip Pape: 17:28

Maybe a challenge, a challenge, right?

Kelly Howard: 17:30

If you have that next step, then the next step up is, and you're doing all of these at once. That's why it's layered. It's not like what try one thing, try another thing, but just do it all. Some of it works, some of it won't, then maybe you need a coach, right? Someone needs to like, I've got a client right now she's like, I can't get to the gym, I might hire a trainer. Do not even want to hear from you again, until you hire a trainer. And so you know, a coach. And then in your North Star, you just, it's it's a pyramid. And it's using everything you have learning that motivation, like motivation always falls in there somewhere. It's a learned skill, something we're born with or not, learn your motivation, find the things, find your triggers, all of these things, just like you know, they pile on top of each other. And if you use them all, you actually end up creating a way of being who you are that then you don't need all of it, because you've got it.

Philip Pape: 18:34

That is good. You don't need it all. Because you've got Ah, that's so good. Because what I what I was thinking of here is, is the support system raise what you're talking about, I think, right? And I haven't heard it put so elegantly. So I like that I'm going to be stealing this in the future. And I'll give credit where it's due. But because sometimes the way I put it is, is you know, you've got, you've got your community, you've got coaches, you've got yourself, right, like it's kind of what you're saying. And don't it's not like a pyramid of hierarchy of needs, where you have to wait for one to exist before the other. It's just kind of in parallel. You're starting to weave these in your life. Where Where does the community fit in as at the middle part where you said, it's all these different things? The event the challenges center? Yeah, I think

Kelly Howard: 19:16

community is probably interspersed throughout, like one way you'd find with communities like right now, we just started an accountability group for the next two months. And we're doing I think there's five people in each group. And I'm kicking it off for you. I'm checking element in with everybody, but it's just starting to get traction. So now all of a sudden, you have these five people who didn't know each other a week ago, are starting to get to know each other. They're, you know, sharing things that matter. And it will keep them going. Right, that will definitely keep them going. And then there's community like your community or my community where you've got those friends that you need, but it is it's woven all in through. Yeah,

Philip Pape: 19:57

I love it. So and if you don't have that to be Getting with it sounds like there's a big gap between now where you want to be with a self accountability because like you said, it starts there and then eventually you want to get to that. Ideally 100% accountable for yourself. Now, is that is that the intrinsic motivation we're talking about? Or what do you? What role does self accountability play? Yeah,

Kelly Howard: 20:18

I think I think it is just like, it just is what you do. Right? It's like, it's for you, right? It's just what you do. It's who you are. It's what you do. In the story. You don't think about it. I mean, every so often, you might have one, like, this morning, I had one of those days. My timing was off. It was a, it was a wait day timings off. I'm, I'm thinking my first thought was, well, I'll just put this off till tomorrow. And then, you know, I'll do it. I'll do it Saturday, and I have less stuff going on. And then my brain my, the other part of my brain was like, Kelly, I call BS on that, because you will not do it tomorrow. And you know, so what's your options, and, you know, it's like, you've got the devil in the angel on your shoulders, and you negotiate. For me, I negotiate it, okay, I'll cut it shorter. But I'm going to do what I said I was gonna do, and ended up not even cutting it shorter. I just, my day just started a little later. But, but it is, it's that thing where you have to, you have to on this one, just be willing to have super awareness, super awareness of yourself. That that gets you where you need to be. For sure

Philip Pape: 21:27

you hit it there at the end with self awareness. Almost anything you take emotion, emotional intelligence, you know, setting these goals, like you said, the deeper purpose, take some level of just intentionality and thinking about who you are what you're trying to get out of this. When you mentioned the giving yourself excuses with the devil on your shoulder. I like that it brought up two things to mind. One is where we, we know so much deep in our soul, we want to do it. So even though we're starting to make this excuse, we still find a way. And we find a way we want to find a way. And the other is it almost becomes the opposite of excuse making sometimes I know, at least for me, when I work out, I will make excuses to work out. Because I haven't I want to do it so badly. That it becomes the opposite problem, which is not a terrible thing to have. It's shows how much momentum you have built into it. Yeah, where some of the other person in the room is like, it's too cold. You know, the gyms too far. You know, it's like, other excuses. Yeah,

Kelly Howard: 22:27

no, it's, uh, you're right, it is momentum. Yeah, because you know, a body in motion stays in motion, and you just have to figure out what's going to keep you moving.

Unknown: 22:37

Before my coaching session with Phillip, I was really struggling with staying consistent with my nutrition, Phillip really showed me the importance of being consistent day to day, he also helped me see that it's not a bad thing to take a rest day, he really helps me get in that more positive headspace of a rest day being something really good for me. I've been doing this for a month now. And I'm finally starting to see some progress and my numbers. And I'm really excited about that. And I just appreciate so much the help that Philip has given me. He's always willing to answer questions to offer resources that are totally free, and very, very helpful. So I just want to say how much I appreciate that. Thanks, Phil.

Philip Pape: 23:22

So what happens when things get really tough then and life happens, life's going to happen? And it just pushes you past that brink of even the self accountability just not gonna carry through at that point? Yeah.

Kelly Howard: 23:35

Perfect. The perfect question, because probably 99% of people that I work with, they've gotten to that point where they went, you know what? I've tried it all. It's not gonna work. I don't know why you think this is gonna work, right? And what that really is, is it's not that they've tried it all, and it's not gonna work. It's that they weren't really willing to restart when they stopped. And that's life, right? It's just restarting every time we have to, like, I mean, it's just the way it is. There are lots of times I came back from Costa Rica. It was an amazing trip. And I was like, Whoa, I am way behind. And what did I do? I just like dove in and started working good. And after three days, I went, Kelly, you gotta restart what matters? And it's not that I just went, Oh, well, I didn't start my workouts right away. So I might as well just give up, essentially, just start again, every time.

Philip Pape: 24:38

That's good. That's good. I've seen this happen to me. And also I've seen clients who we work with them for a long time. You see what life brings in terms of cycles? Yeah, and if one bad thing after another can happen to people like within a span of days or weeks, and all of a sudden these things fall off for a decent amount of time, right and it may not be in your control but like you said What is your mindset? Is it okay, I'm done? And it's like starting over, or am I just restarting what I already have? So, yeah, that's a healthy way to think about it. You know, and

Kelly Howard: 25:10

the thing is, is that if we're restarting, we have a foundation that we didn't have before. Every time like, people don't realize this, and, and then they'll say to me, oh, my gosh, you know, I was able to do XYZ. And I'm like, of course, you are, like, you have a foundation. You just might have missed some time. It's like

Philip Pape: 25:29

muscle memory. I actually, that's a great analogy. It's like muscle memory when people lifted for years, and then they stop. Even if it's 10 years later, they started listening again, the strength comes back quickly. Right? Yeah, your brain just knows it's wired for it. Exactly. Good one. So it should be easier than is the point. All right. So the the whole thing about events, you talked about the middle part of the layered accountability. I had a gentleman on my show very cards recently talked about Miss Sogi. I don't know if you've heard the term. But it's having this big, maybe this scary, like annual event to look forward to? You know, like, for him it was this giant mountain climb. Right. And then you also mentioned the importance of having something to look forward to plans to look forward to so maybe dig into that one. How, what are some concrete examples of where you use that? Or people can do that?

Kelly Howard: 26:16

Oh, yeah. So okay. I hope that people listening, your audience likes the idea of adventure, because I'm gonna just come back to this again and again. For myself, I will say that, every year, I go and meet some friends for about a 10 day, whitewater kayaking, I know that if I'm not able to carry that kayak, up and down for miles, if I'm not able to do all the things that it takes, I'm not gonna have as much fun. I am not about to ask somebody for help. So that would be, I guess, in the scope Muskogee for me is that I know that's coming. And by gosh, I'm going to make sure that I put it into my training. For other people, it could be something different. It could be for years, I did like mini triathlon sprint. And so that was always one of those things have always had this one particular one. That was the hardest one ever, like, nobody would sign up because it was so darn hard. And they'd be like, Why are you doing that? And like, it's so hard. You just feel so good when you get done. Right? So, and it can be different for all of us. Like, it doesn't have to be like the hardest sprint you've ever found or a Olympic trial you've ever found. But it can be something that you know is going to push you so far past your limit, that you never come back to who you were before. It's nice. Yeah, expanding that comfort zone. Yeah. Okay,

Philip Pape: 27:46

so that that sounds great. I am inspired to think about next year and where that's gonna happen in my life since I had two little two girls, and they love adventure, too. So what does is that enough? Or is are there like quarterly check ins and plans that you recommend? Like what's what's your general philosophy on? Since we're talking about not losing weight and all the boring stuff went? How frequent is your cadence on these kinds of?

Kelly Howard: 28:09

Yeah, that's a good question. So I think that, like having watched a lot of accountability groups, having run a bunch of accountability groups, what I've noticed is that people are usually pretty solid for except for let's let's take New Year's out because New Year's is an outlier, right? But if they get started on something, you're usually pretty solid for six to eight weeks, you know, that's they can hang, then things happen. Maybe they've been putting off the work that needs to happen next month needs to get taken care of, or the you know, whatever it is. So, somewhere in that six to eight week period, I always ask people just like, recheck in, you know, restart, almost recommit, then the other number is 90 days. And I like 90 days, because 90 days is such a, it's a quarter, it's like a friend of mine always says it's like 1% of the next 25 years of your life. I'm like, wow, actually, she's right, if you do the math, so that's just like 1% What's 90 days gonna give you and then stretch it way out once a year, like think of the changes that you could make in a year. And if you can look at those and then bring it back always I ask everybody to bring it back to what's next What's tomorrow? Right like what's really going on tomorrow because you can dream all you want but if you're not knowing exactly what's coming up next. Yeah,

Philip Pape: 29:36

that's great. And otherwise it's just this black hole leading up to the future of overwhelm almost like what you know there's there's nothing that's there in a way from without those check ins. So it's interesting because I've heard different philosophy or science on on all of this how like having seasons and having holidays are really good for humans in terms of, you know, pushing you to do things Um, could a process itself and I'm kind of asking this selfishly, I lift weights, and I like to lift for a cycle, I like to go for maybe 1216 weeks. And so I think, okay, at the end of that, I'm going to do something very different. And those are going to drive, how I eat and how I sleep and do all my other things. That would that work for folks like just having their process kind of periodized? In that way? Do you know what I'm saying? Yeah,

Kelly Howard: 30:26

I know exactly what you're saying. So when I have somebody who's going with me on a trip, usually those trips are a stretch, a big stretch, right? And so when we're training for it, what I asked him to do is to start out, and it's a little different than you because you have this solid foundation, right? So you can do 12 to 16 weeks, boom, you're on it. But a lot of people don't have that foundation. So I asked them to start out like the first week, it's kind of like a build week, you know, or a foundational week, and then the next week, we step it up, the next week, we step it up. And then that fourth week, we bring it back a little bit. Like it's an easier week. And then next next month, you know, step it up, steps up, but it's exactly what we talked about earlier, because every time they come back, they're coming back to a higher level in their foundation. And they're also paying attention to exactly what you said their sleep. Is this working with their sleep? Is it making it better or worse? Now, how's their nutrition? And it allows them to be really cognizant what's going on in their bodies, when in fact, a lot of them have never really thought about it before? And it's always been just kind of eat less calories and, and, you know, do more cardio to lose weight.

Philip Pape: 31:46

Yeah, right? No, I like that approach. It's the analogies is be like progressive overload or taking the loads, and you're saying you're pushing and progressing each week, but then you're kind of resetting, taking a break, recovering, and then you're continuing to push. And that's that's a clever idea of people listening, think about how to apply that creatively to different things that they're doing. So that it's not always go, go, go, go, go. And push, push, push. And maybe just add to that thinking out loud. The things in your life that would normally interrupt what you're doing. You can naturally schedule those in that fourth week that put them off with that week. Yeah, exactly. Just planted like when people say, should I should I strength train for the week? I'm on vacation? I'm like, probably not. But like, why don't we think ahead and make sure that that week is the week you don't need? Right.

Kelly Howard: 32:34

Right?

Philip Pape: 32:35

This is good stuff. Okay, so you talked about there's the big event, and we talked about a little bit of the comfort zone expanding? And I know, Different people use different phrases, some some say, going out of your comfort zone. I like expanding it because because it allows you to kind of hold on to part of your comfort zone. How can I guess where was my question gonna be on? This is like how I how can women in particular because I know that your audience, try these new experiences, you know, to get out of their comfort zone.

Kelly Howard: 33:04

So I'll bring it back in. And I'll tell you this, the number one thing I hear people say, when I mentioned anything like, like what we're talking about, like, you know, expanding, they'll say, I don't want to hold people back. Or the flip side of that is I don't know if I can keep up. So when you hear those words, to me, that's like, you know, somebody to stab me in the heart? Because Absolutely, you can. And so how do you do it? So using that, and then just figuring out that it's not as big a push as you think it is? Like, I'll use a little quick story, like I do a lot longest in cycling. I'm not a great cyclist. I mean, I can go but I'm not fast. And it used to drive me crazy, because all my friends would be up there and they get to the rest stop. And then here it comes Kelly right. And one day I started counting how far ahead of me are they really, they were like 15 seconds, maybe, maybe, maybe 30 seconds on a big day. Like I can see him up there. And it suddenly occurred to me that it's just not that big a deal. Right? It's just not that big a deal. And when you can start thinking that way, then it's easier to just relax and do these things. appreciate them and go for it. And and that comfort zone is becomes an easier thing to push. Because all of a sudden you're just realizing that it's just

Philip Pape: 34:34

not that big a thing. Yeah, it's almost like you're saying that instead of focusing on the gap, this huge, whatever the gap is, it's more of just continuing to gain toward whatever

Kelly Howard: 34:46

they are. Exactly. Exactly. What is the gap in the game. The game

Philip Pape: 34:50

of the game. Right, right. Exactly. Did is that on your podcast? That actually sounds okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah, but I feel like I've heard that before. He's either Listen to so many. Alright, so let's bring it full circle here. You know, I'm all about fun, positivity adventure, you know, where does the fun and positivity part fit into this? Particularly for people who made that may not be their natural tendency, let's just say, What are your thoughts on that? And the fun part

Kelly Howard: 35:20

of it? Yeah. Oh, well, okay. I think deep down inside my absolute goal in life is to get everybody to go play. Like, I that's, that's what I've always been right? I can, no, I'm like this. And I'm not a good cheerleader, but I can cheer people on. So everybody should play, play gives us it takes our mind off of the pain. If, like, just recently a very, very long, hard hike, I was trying to be playful, because it was super painful, takes our mind off the pain. But more than that, it it gives us something larger to think about something bigger to play with in life. And play again, I don't think a lot of us have as much fun as we should. Really, like it's probably true. You know, we take things are very serious. Life is busy, and getting busier and busier and busier, the world has been probably even a little bit more crazy than it normally is. And we get consumed. And as soon as we get consumed in that our it's like our broad scope of awareness start shrinking. And when we can play more, have more fun. Our scope of awareness increases. When it increases, it allows us to see all the opportunities that are out there for us. And we have better choices, we can find new things to do. We can enjoy ourselves more. So it's probably a self fulfilling prophecy. The more fun you have, the more fun you have.

Philip Pape: 36:56

I need to make sure to schedule that go kart I wanted to do with my kids, they just go for it. That's funny you say that because I know in my life with my two daughters, we I'm really busy. But we have we have we call daddy time every day. And there's always some little way to quote unquote play even if the rest of the day is just jam packed. You know, it could be putting Legos together or good for whatever. But but sometimes you're right, we get caught up and you know, maybe plays different for different people. And you could play on your own I suspect and with other people like doesn't matter. Is it more about the social aspect of players just doing something to amuse yourself?

Kelly Howard: 37:35

Oh, yeah. So for me, I tend to be an introvert. Okay, actually, most of the stuff I do unless I'm on a whitewater river I'm doing by myself. And you know, like me, you have probably an unusual schedule. So I can go at certain times. So I do play by myself a lot. And when I can I reach out to friends and say, Hey, do you want to go do something? And keep asking until they can? Because there should be for me. It's like 8020 80% By myself. 20% social, and I love that social. And I love the time alone to

Philip Pape: 38:13

cool. Yeah, I mean, there's that I encouraged people listening, just think about, especially as we go into the holidays here and so for some people, it gets even more hectic in different ways. How can you find time to play whatever play means to you? I imagine that could be that could be a board game that could be a sport that could be going for a walk at a fun place. You haven't been to believe there's million ways you can define it. Right? It's just something entertaining. Yeah. Okay, really,

Kelly Howard: 38:36

if there's something that I have my clients do all the time, as I say, creative, listless. Okay, I want you to just write down if you could do something, what would it be, if you if there's something that you love to do, write it down, and, and keep writing until you've got a list of 2530 things. And some of them are going to be play. Some of them might be you know, reading, like for me taken off top taking time off during the middle of the day to read. That's like, that's like Sneaky, sneaky. But I love it. Right? So. So finding that thing, if you've always got that list, and you can pick from it when you when you have time where you forget. That's

Philip Pape: 39:19

great. It's been intentional about it instead of when you're when you're exhausted at the end of the day, and maybe have a half an hour an hour. And now you just go watch TV, which again, watching TV could be a fun thing occasionally as well. But, you know, being intentional about is here. Yeah. I think yeah, no, this has been great. I think we covered a lot of what we wanted to but I do I do like to ask guests one this one question toward the end here. And that is, is there anything you wished I had asked? And what is your answer? Oh, I

Kelly Howard: 39:45

love that. I love it. I always I asked people what I'm trying to get, you know, details out of them. Like coaching. Is there something you should ask let me think for just one second. Sure. Um honestly, I don't think so, like you're spot on when you do these podcasts. I love your podcast. Cool. I appreciate that. Yeah, I mean, you, you ask the questions, and we covered a lot of ground. Yes. Yeah. Great.

Philip Pape: 40:18

And you made it easy. I mean, yeah, I think we meandered to all the things in that one topic. Of course, we can always talk about a million other things. But in that area, the fun the adventure, the consistency, accountability, I think we covered some really actual stuff. So thank you. Yes, thank you. So what where can people find you, Kelly, where do you want them to reach out to you?

Kelly Howard: 40:37

Easiest place is just the website, which is that is freedom.com. It leads to my book, at least my social at least, finding me if you'd like to ask me questions. That's just the simplest place.

Philip Pape: 40:50

Beautiful. Okay, fit is freedom.com. And your book is available as well. And I will put that in the show notes so people can can find you. And again, Kelly, this has been a pleasure. Thank you so much for coming on. Thank you

Kelly Howard: 41:01

very much. And thank you for everybody listening.

Philip Pape: 41:06

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