Why Preparing for Menopause Starts Early

Philip Pape 0:01

If you're a woman in your 30s thinking menopause is decades away and not worth worrying about yet , and you believe that when the time comes , you'll just figure it out with your doctor . But you want to maintain your strength , your energy and your physique as you age , without being blindsided by changes that could derail your progress . This episode is for you . Today , my guest reveals why waiting until perimenopause symptoms appear is already too late . The women who thrive through menopause started preparing decades earlier . You'll discover the hidden timeline of hormonal changes that begins years before you notice symptoms , the silent killers that affect asymptomatic women and the specific biohacks that can transform your menopause experience from survival mode to optimization . Welcome to Wits and Weights , the show that helps you build a strong , healthy physique using evidence , engineering and efficiency . I'm your host , philip Pape , and today we are discussing why preparing for menopause should start potentially decades before you think it does .

Philip Pape 1:03

My guest today is Zora Benamou , a gerontologist and biohacker who hosts the amazing Hack my Age podcast . Go follow that right now Hack my Age . She holds a master's in gerontology from USC , has specialized certifications in menopause through the Institute of Bioidentical Medicine . At 54 , she embodies what she teaches living as a digital nomad while interviewing women about menopause experiences in every country she visits . Through hundreds I think well over 300 podcast episodes and interviews with hundreds of women worldwide , zora has identified patterns . We love patterns . We love data . This is very helpful to you guys that most women never see coming . Today , you're going to learn why the strongest , most resilient women through this period of life , through menopause , are those who started preparing early on in their 30s , what the research reveals about hormonal trajectories and the specific biohacks that create the biggest impacts decades later . So maybe you're in your 30s thinking this doesn't apply to you yet , or you're approaching perimenopause , wondering what you should be doing right now . Either way , this conversation is going to answer your questions and , zora , thank you so much for coming on the show .

Zora Benhamou 2:13

No thanks for having me . I should update the bio . I'm now 55 . I forgot to do that .

Philip Pape 2:17

Yes , I was thinking about it . When it comes to age and these biographies , I was wanting to say that so you know , but you look like 35 , right ? So , and that's the demographic we're talking to today , and this might sound like a basic question , but how well informed do you think women are about what menopause even is and what to expect ?

Zora Benhamou 3:08

no-transcript . Unfortunately , no one's preparing for us . As for menopause , usually our mothers are not speaking to us about it , our doctors are not prepared about it . Our doctors don't really know as much about it . It's not part of the medical curriculum in most medical schools and there's not a whole lot of research on it as well . So when you consider , actually not that long ago , women were dying in their 50s . It wasn't a topic really of concern . So it's now that we're living longer . It's now that we're living longer . We are living now up to 30 , sometimes 40% of our lives women in menopause and or this post menopause stage . So in fact , we need to understand menopause a whole lot more and we're just unfortunately , scratching the surface of it . So women are not informed and but but they are getting informed by social media and podcasts .

Philip Pape 4:11

Yeah , it is . You know , even all the interviews that I've done and the women I've

The Truth About Menopause Misconceptions

Philip Pape 4:13

spoken to and research in this , and also this idea that , okay , I'm a man , so of course I don't understand this , but every woman around me must understand this . And if only I was Mel Gibson and I could read women's minds in that movie he was in , which is a terrible thought actually . I don't want to do that , not because of the women , but because of how I would handle the information and then talking to my wife and thinking how her mom didn't talk to her about half the things that she needed to know later in life . And all of that makes sense now .

Philip Pape 4:37

And , guys , if you go check out Zora's Instagram , you'll see these interviews with women where they're asked very I'll call them simple questions that if you follow the health space , you might know some of these , and yet a vast majority of women don't seem to be aware . So education is important , but also the misconceptions , I think , and the gaslighting and the lack of studies into women's health over the years that we're finally maybe starting to catch up on , I don't know , of all that information in those interviews . What are the , I guess , dangerous misconceptions ? First , that we can kind of get out of the way and then we can dive into some more like of the helpful information we want to run with .

Zora Benhamou 5:11

Oh , some of the misconceptions . Well , very often I'll ask a woman about . I say one of the first questions I ask is are you in menopause or perimenopause ? And they'll say no , I'm too young . Or or , and I said , well , how old are you ? And she's like I'm 45 . I'm like that's pretty perimenopausal . I mean , it's possible , very possible , to be in menopause at that age .

Zora Benhamou 5:34

So a lot of one of the biggest myths is that women think that it's for older women and to not even be concerned about and that I'm totally guilty as charged with this . I was in my 40s , didn't even know there was a word called perimenopause and if you ask me about menopause I was like , oh , that's something I'll think about when I'm 50 , past 50 , for sure . So it's only now , because we're sort of having this menopause movement , that people are becoming a little bit more aware of menopause and that word called perimenopause . But another answer I get very often from women in their 60s or 70s and they say , no , I didn't do menopause . Or I didn't get menopause , and I'm like , well , do you still have a period ? Oh , no , no . But they're referring to the symptoms of menopause .

Zora Benhamou 6:18

Interesting , okay , they didn't feel a hot flash or they didn't suffer or they didn't . So menopause is such a broad word because we're using it for perimenopause and postmenopause . We use it for symptoms , and it's one of these things . We need to be a little bit more granular when we're asking what this is . But yeah , so those are some of the misconceptions that I think I get typically , and again , this is universal . This is not something only to women in Poland or in Thailand . I get very similar responses .

Philip Pape 6:46

Yeah , it makes sense , and the questions I get from women all the time are then , you know , I don't get questions like what are menopause , obviously , or to help me understand menopause . It's more like these things are happening . I think I'm in perimenopause or postmenopause and therefore it is causing issues I never had before with my physique , my body , you know menopause , my fat distribution . By the way , there's a new study that came out about that . It's fascinating . We should talk about that offline Brand new study about fat distribution that really is happening right During menopause Again , to not deny the reality of it . And so maybe it's helpful , zora , to understand the timeline right . Is this a predominantly a hormonal timeline or are there other factors ? Is this more systemic that women should be thinking about across their ages ? So if we started from , I don't know what makes sense 30 and then go like , okay , 30s , 40s , 50s what is happening and what should you be aware of so we can start taking action earlier ?

Zora Benhamou 7:42

Good question . As a gerontologist , I always say longevity starts in childhood , and now in my menopause space , I'm saying actually menopause starts in childhood . We should know about it from very early on , just like we do our periods or something . When you think about women , the changes that we have in our hormones throughout our lifetime , from puberty and pregnancy and menopause it's not just menopause . I think women at all ages should understand that we have hormones , that they can fluctuate , that we have testosterone , estrogen and progesterone our main hormones . There's plenty of other hormones we can dive into if they want to , but those are just sort of the basics . I think that we should learn from very early on , and so anyone who's listening to this at any age , start learning about it and start talking to your kids about it , because it's just a part of life and that's fine , it's natural . It's part of life , just like your periods . We shouldn't be ashamed of it .

Zora Benhamou 8:41

There's still major stigma and major stereotypes around it as well . That can be frightening for the younger people , like what they see on social media . It's horrifying , in fact . Another myth that we need to bust is that everyone has a different experience . Right , we all have the same experience , but the truth is we all have different experiences and there's plenty of women who are sailing through menopause without those outward symptoms . The things are happening on the inside , but on the outside they're actually looking great , they're feeling great and we want to disrupt some of those as well .

Zora Benhamou 9:16

But I think definitely , if you are at any age seeing a change in your mood or in your periods or your skin , think about your hormones . Maybe and I'm not saying it's menopause or perimenopause it could be some hormonal shift and it could be just a temporary shift because of any kind of outward factors or inward factors . But I would say , if you want to dive a little deeper into menopause

Understanding Your Hormonal Timeline

Zora Benhamou 9:44

in your 30s is a really good time , because the average age of losing our progesterone , which is one of our main hormones , sex hormones is happening about age 35 . And it actually takes a really steep dive around 35 . Not estrogen , everybody's like oh , we all fall off the cliff and menopause , no estrogen . Actually , the loss from our 30s is a lot more gradual than progesterone .

Zora Benhamou 10:13

So the signs of progesterone loss would be maybe you are not sleeping as well as you used to , maybe you're a little bit more anxious , or anxious when you never were before , or a little bit moody and it's outside of , let's say , your period , we can say oh , during certain cycles , and maybe I'm always like that , but if it's shifting it's kind of like every night I'm struggling with sleep then that's a sign that maybe this is your progesterone starting to head out the door , because we have early perimenopause , we have mid perimenopause and we have late perimenopause or so , like all these different stages in the early perimenopause is in your 30s .

Zora Benhamou 10:53

So just being aware of that , because your doctor may go oh , you know you need , you're depressed or here's an antidepressant which maybe you need but maybe you don't , and so the low hanging fruit for me would be like well , why don't you just go test your progesterone if you're in your thirties and see maybe if you're low , and then you can decide if you want to top it up with hormones or some do some other type of protocol to try to balance out your hormones . But understanding your hormones , definitely for preparation for peri and post-menopause , is a good idea in your thirties .

Philip Pape 11:25

Yeah , you definitely for preparation for peri and post-menopause is a good idea in your 30s . Yeah , you have a lot of good takeaways that I want to dive into . So we'll kind of go backwards , since that's fresh in the mind of testing your labs and knowing your numbers , and I think that's great for everyone . As a coach myself , the more I realize that biofeedback and natural lifestyle changes will take you to a certain point and you should be doing those . But then there could be other , you know physiological changes that are happening , men and women at any age , like you said , and it's good to have a baseline right , it's good to just know . Maybe this is my normal .

Philip Pape 11:54

So when it comes to understanding your hormones , people get overwhelmed and they also often can't find the support they need in the medical industry . This is what I've heard . Zora right , is that traditional GPs and healthcare practitioners hey , you're 30 , you're too young , we're not going to test this right ? Another myth , right ? Or you go to , you know there's these day by , you know , fly by night clinics everywhere too , trying to make a buck off of irresponsible prescription of , especially testosterone clinics , but anyway . So anybody listening , who , who , let's say she's 25 or 30 , she's listening and wants to get labs . What's the best approach for that ?

Zora Benhamou 12:30

Oh , I would say it depends on the symptoms really , and you know if we're talking about possible menopause or perimenopause . But but it's so much more than that . It's not just the loss of your hormones , especially earlier on . It could be if you're tired , it could be just a vitamin deficiency , right ? Maybe possibly vitamin Bs . So I would say it's not just .

Zora Benhamou 12:51

Let's say you can look at your estrogen , I would say still in your 20s and 30s , know where you're at , do your estrogens , your progesterone and your testosterone and like all your markers . Like it's great to know where you're at when you're healthy , when you're young and full of hormones , because we're finding out , as we are trying to figure out our formula , our hormone like , if a woman is taking hormones , there is no one size fits all . There isn't like , here you go , a hundred milligrams of progesterone for everybody , which is kind of what starting point like doctors to do , but you'll find some women they need 50 , some women need 200 . Same thing goes for their estrogens that they're taking . Some women need much higher doses because they're not absorbing and others need lower dosages . And some are feeling great with lower blood levels of , say , estrogen , and some need higher .

Zora Benhamou 13:41

And so we don't really know if maybe I was always like that's normal for me to be low or it's normal for me to be high . We don't really know , because I wasn't testing my sex hormones in my twenties and thirties . I wish I did so . It is a good time to just get the full blood panel . When I was in my twenties and thirties it would never even occurred to me to get a full blood panel of anything , unless you were sick right , so but now you're physical right yeah yeah , we're in this health optimization space , so , like I wish I did it .

Zora Benhamou 14:12

So I do recommend just getting all those sex hormones done and your thyroid and , of course , your cardiovascular markers and some of these big bone densities . Another one , because actually you can start losing your bone in your 30s . It's very normal to start losing your bone right in your 30s , so it's like you may be surprised if you have osteopenia in your 20s and 30s and so you need to do something about it so that you don't get up to 50 and have a fracture and I don't know . I remember if we talked about this last time with you , but there's not only a bone density scan , but there's one that shows bone strength as well , because you can have lower bone density but actually have really strong bones , so you don't need to panic if you have a low bone density , if they are strong . What scan is that ?

Zora Benhamou 15:00

for the bone strength . It's called the REM scan , r-e-m-ms , you know , I don't know radio electromagnetic something , I don't remember that . It's a long name , sure , but it's a rem scan as opposed to a dexa scan and it's a really good . I think it's . I think it's great . It's kind of new . It's technology hasn't been adopted yet . A lot of people haven't heard of it , and they didn't hear about dexone that first came out either . So I think it just still needs some time . But I think it's . It's really awesome because it does a lot . It does the same thing that Dexa does , but even more .

Philip Pape 15:31

Yeah , just so the listener knows , when Zora mentioned last time we talked , we have an episode on Hack my Age coming out where we talked about bone and muscle strength and lifting and all of that related to this , so definitely check that out . Nice plug there .

Zora Benhamou 15:44

Okay , yeah , thank you . Yeah , it was a fun conversation .

Philip Pape 15:48

Okay . So getting a baseline is a good idea . There's a lot of ways to do it now . You could do it out of pocket through like a local lab . You could do it through a medical person . You also mentioned symptoms . Symptoms mean important , and it sounds like you're saying as soon as symptoms are obvious , or at least start to present themselves and aren't temporary or not associated with something that you know has occurred , let's say periodically , that's also an indication , right ? We hear the same with men with testosterone . It's like it may not just be in the numbers , it may be in the symptoms or a combination of the two . When should someone freak out versus and think that it's a hormone thing or something else ? You know what I mean Versus . These are normal , because I suspect I heard was it you or somebody talking about hot flashes and they were totally surprised about how it actually felt when they got there . It was totally different what they expected . You know what I'm saying .

Zora Benhamou 16:37

So , like yeah , that wasn't me , but .

Philip Pape 16:38

I .

Zora Benhamou 16:39

I've heard that before too . I still haven't had one . I felt hot , but it not the classic I that that will be me if I ever have one , because I have an idea what it may feel like . But I'm actually . I wore a vest . It was funny because I went to one of these menopause society conferences and they have a vest that you can wear , that men and women , everyone can wear to mimic a hot flash and they have it all the way up to your neck and they just turn up the heat and you , you , you feel it . But for me I was like , are you sure it's on ? And they were like it's funny because most people are feeling and they touch

Testing and Managing Hormones

Zora Benhamou 17:20

, like , yeah , it's on , I'm like I don't know . I guess I do saunas too many , too often .

Philip Pape 17:24

You like to eat , you know yeah .

Zora Benhamou 17:26

I didn't honestly feel very much . But she says normally people go wow , that's pretty intense . So you can , you can feel that . But the question you had was I wanted to . When do you freak out for someone who should ?

Philip Pape 17:39

never freak out . How can you recognize that these are symptoms worth investigating ?

Zora Benhamou 17:44

Investigating yes , investigating , and you're just there investigating and it's going to be hard to investigate when you're perimenopause in terms of testing your blood work , because you can test in the morning and then test in the evening and there'll be totally different levels or tests in one day and then the other . But a really good medical practitioner or any kind of practitioner and someone who understands hormones , will tell you to test on certain days of the month , usually 19 to 22 . Well , it depends on what you're testing and then they'll say they'll look for certain levels and then they may ask you to repeat it several times or take a urine test which can look at metabolites over the course of 24 hours . There's many different types of tests that you can see in terms of where your hormones are and what they're doing and how they're behaving , which pathways the metabolites are going down , which is quite interesting . So I would say a woman , usually at most ages , she understands her periods very well . You know when it's coming and usually at most ages , she understands her periods very well . Like you know when it's coming and usually women are quite regular , whether it's always day 25 or always day 28 or day 29 . And she'll notice if something's off If something is . Maybe she's a little bit earlier or a little bit later , maybe her periods are a little bit heavier , or maybe they're a little bit lighter , or maybe she even skips a month and she's not pregnant . So I think a period is a really good indication . So I strongly advise , like any girl who get your period , start getting a period tracker or an app or something , and understand the fluctuations and know , and you're going to know what to expect . So I think that's a really good biomarker to follow .

Zora Benhamou 19:30

And then and then , if you , in terms of , could this be perimenopause ? Again , there are documented 103 symptoms , 103 . So really could be anything . Changes in hair , hair thinning , these are , these are , you know , signs of perimenopause . Changes in skin usually it's more dry and that's a lack of estrogen . But when you think of you speak to a teenager and they get acne and they're like it's on the chin , it must be hormonal . Like that's hormonal , probably not perimenopause . Again , it depends on the chin , it must be hormonal . Like that's hormonal , probably not perimenopause . Again , it depends on the age and what you are . But if you , if you are working with somebody who understands menopause , then then you usually can spit out some of these symptoms and then a doctor may conclude , yeah , this could be , yeah , some kind of hormonal shift , which is could be perimenopause or it could be again something else .

Zora Benhamou 20:26

And it was interesting because I was just speaking to another person before you and we were talking about treatments and I've been listening to this episode . Did you watch the Diary of a CEO ? Yeah , for sure , there was this episode I'm watching right now about herbs and herbal treatments and this is a herbalist and he's talking about all these things . And he said , and he had this is a case study I have , you know , sheila , she's 39 and she has moodiness , anxiety , changes in her period . I'm like , ah , she's in pause , like you know . So so my first thought is test her hormones . And then , you know , you can maybe offer her some Jethro cream topically , and you know it's very , very safe . But he's thinking , no , I gave her X , y and Z herbs and now she felt better . Her periods are regular .

Zora Benhamou 21:18

So , you know , is it a hormonal ? Is it perimenopause ? Almost doesn't matter , but like it's , you have a menu of choice in terms of how do you want to feel better ? And it may be it's , and if you talk to a Chinese medicine doctor , it may be you know what . You need to start moving more , you need to exercise a little bit . Maybe you need to eat certain foods and they're very much into the whole thing . You got to lower your stress and that will be the prescription that you get and you can choose . But I would love doctors , now or the future , to offer what resonates better with you , like hormones , or do you want herbs ? Do you want to just change your lifestyle ? But in terms of panicking , I would say , if you rule out , if you did some hormonal testing and you've you got , you got to go by symptoms . You get to rule out , because if you're bleeding and it could be something very , very serious , you're bleeding really heavily . So again , you know some doctors are actually there .

Zora Benhamou 22:22

I don't know if you've interviewed Kim Vopney , but she's just brilliant when it comes to pelvic floors and pelvic floor health and she talks a lot about how hysterectomies are overprescribed , especially women in their thirties and forties , when you're very heavy , bleaker , and it's kind of like the first thing to go , let's just remove , you know , your ovaries or let's just remove the uterus , like we

Biohacking for Better Menopause

Zora Benhamou 22:43

, we don't need that and I've met women who agreed to that and they didn't realize .

Zora Benhamou 22:48

Oh wait , I wanted kids , what do I do ? And they got gypped out of that , and so you should really be informed of all the things that are positive and negative when it comes to certain things , especially when it comes to surgery . So her low hanging fruit is always going into progesterone or hormones . Right , let's look like we don't need to take out these body parts . Maybe you do need to , I don't know , but it's not . It shouldn't be the first call to action , and , and so I would say , if anyone is , you know , in their thirties and they they're told that they need to have a hysterectomy , I would certainly exhaust everything else first that are less invasive , and then go on to say if there's nothing else that works , then okay , maybe do what you have to do with me and people I've talked to as well .

Philip Pape 23:42

You mentioned herbs , right , and I think , okay , adaptogens , right . I've known women who have some anxiety or stress and they're doing everything right , you know . They're trying to manage the stress naturally and something's just different that wasn't there a couple of years ago and then they started taking ashwagandha and it's like night and day and that's all they need for the next 10 years . You know what I mean . It's interesting and we don't know why . That is right . It's probably something in our , the way we live today in Western society , that is triggering that in some sense . Right , with the stress that we're not eliminating . But you know , having a menu of options is a great idea . I also , you know , I'm a big fan of lifting , of course , and I think for a lot of people just like , if they're not lifting and then they start lifting weights and exercising , that right , there is a huge game changer for anyone to try . At least it's free , it's your own body , do it .

Zora Benhamou 24:32

But yeah , taking out your uterus and ovaries is different . You can raise your testosterone levels for free with just lifting weights . You don't need to buy anything . I mean everybody's different , of course , but you can measure this stuff . You can really just measure your testosterone now and go lift some heavy weights and see if it moved the needle right .

Philip Pape 24:51

That's biohacking 101 , right , the very basic of taking a before and after , you know . Thyroid comes to mind too , because you're talking hormones , and that seems to be another big issue today is and for a lot of people , that they're just under eating and that's what's doing it , and for others it is some sort of wonky relationship between their T3 versus T3 , t4 conversion , and that's where it gets complicated . Estrogen , too , with the estradiol and the testosterone of the DHEA , it's like so much so yeah .

Zora Benhamou 25:19

Have you heard of thyropause ? Okay , I can guess what it is it's thyroid-related menopause or something .

Philip Pape 25:26

What is that ?

Zora Benhamou 25:27

Yeah , it's when your thyroid goes south and it's usually during this period of life . Dr Amy Horniman , we did a recording . I'll connect you to her if you don't know her , because she's brilliant . She's called the Thyroid Fixer and that's her podcast and she's just so focused on thyroid . And we did an episode on thyropause and she calls thyroid the master hormone , like some people would say . You know , cortisol is a master hormone . Some people say thyroid is .

Zora Benhamou 25:54

I mean , it depends who you are , what your specialty is , but the game is that all the hormones are interconnected . It's not just let's just put in one and we'll replenish it . No , that one will have an effect , a downstream effect , on other hormones . It's the symphony and it's about getting it right . And that's why so many women in menopause , when they start hormone therapy , they're like this is not working or I feel worse , or I feel nothing . Well , because you have to find the right levers to pull and there's just no one size fits all and I encourage them to don't give up like just try up or down , or different formula or different dosage or different completely delivery method . Again , we're all so different if you go down that route . So , but again , a lot of these things can be pulled .

Philip Pape 26:41

The levers can be pulled outside of hormones as well , so yes , yes , and I think it's a good approach to look at both . Right Is what you're saying is like be open to both , do some biohacking , do some measurements , Like it's fairly inexpensive . Thyroid is an interesting one . I have a coach on my team .

Philip Pape 27:08

She's personal experience of hypothyroidism and Hashimoto's , and thyroiditis , and so she's learned a lot through that process . I actually worked with Karen Martell , who I know is a friend of yours , and you guys connect all the time and I love Karen too . She and I have connected , so it's like a small circle here . But the thyroid thing is interesting because it regulates your metabolism right and so if it's off , that could significantly affect your metabolic rate and like what I see just you start a small calorie deficit and your body just immediately adapts , and then you try to increase it , it immediately adapts . It's kind of a funky thing that creates what seems like weight loss resistance . You know , obviously if you starve yourself you're going to lose weight , but nobody wants to do that , right ? So all this is part of menopause , right ?

Zora Benhamou 27:39

Yeah , yeah , and progesterone also has an effect on the thyroid as well when you're losing your progesterone . So , yeah , there's so many reasons why somebody can have a low thyroid or high thyroid , dysfunctional thyroid . I agree , though , that it is a very important hormone and it's not a thing that we should just brush off , and I think a lot of traditional doctors that when you go to get your labs , the range is really wide , so you can be within the normal range , but still like my hair is falling out and I'm so tired and I'm bloated and I can't lose this weight and they're like I don't know . Your numbers are normal , but that's where we want to get into maybe a functional medicine approach or optimal ranges , because any functional medicine doctor would have a much tighter range and say this is why you're not feeling well , so let's try to figure out how can we move the dial and getting closer into the optimal range , and you'll probably feel better . They won't dismiss you or gaslight you and go out .

Philip Pape 28:41

And there's ratios and there's also your own baseline , like you've already mentioned before . So so that makes me think now , since we're talking about preparing early for this and you mentioned talking to your kids , right Cause that's as early as we can get . I have two daughters as well . I love that my wife talks to them about things we homeschool , so we have like a health subject in there and I've already talked to them about genitals and sex and like all that stuff .

Philip Pape 29:07

To whatever level they they are , it's appropriate for their age . You know things that our parents just didn't do very often like our generation in the 80s . Right but the question is when it comes to menopause , if the mother isn't super informed like it looks like is the case currently and they listen to this podcast the first time they're hearing about this right what should they talk to the kids about In terms of menopause ?

Zora Benhamou 29:30

Sure , yeah , since we're preparing for the menopause , it depends , like you said , age appropriate . How much information can they handle ? What's their interest ? The simple thing is , maybe , if they're in their teenage years you're like , well , you're going to have the discussion about when the periods start . You can also have the conversation that I know it's . You know you're struggling now but it is going to end , and that actually sounds like a really good thing that you won't be living bleeding for the rest of your life and that's because the hormones are starting to decline .

Zora Benhamou 29:59

But just bringing a little bit of awareness in terms of your , I think the period is such a tangible thing for most young people that they can understand that . I would also talk to the boys as well and you can say understand , and I would relate it maybe just overall for hormones , because if there are , whether they're a boy or a girl , they will maybe be dealing with somebody who's going to have a pregnancy or , if not themselves , they will maybe be dealing with somebody who's going to have a pregnancy or , if not themselves , and then they're going to see again a hormonal shift and not think that they're broken and they're falling apart . We're like , no , you're pregnant or you're just post-pregnancy and hormones are trying to shift again . So having that discussion about hormones is really good . And then , as they get older , I think when you , when you are approaching your thirties , then I would start talking about more about progesterone and and how that can decline or just or , and that the hormones go up and down . They're just crazy and it's not you that's crazy . The hormones that are going a little wonky and not to be afraid , and it's totally normal and you have solutions .

Zora Benhamou 31:00

Again , here's this mortgage board of choices that you can do to balance them out and replen phase and again , having that discussion about perimenopause pre , mid and late . But I would also have them understand that we don't know what our menopause journey will be like . Like . There's the whole spectrum . It's not going to be horrible for everybody and not to dismiss that , it can be really horrible .

Zora Benhamou 31:47

You'll have many symptoms . You'll have all of them under the sun and they're going to be extreme and that happens , totally can happen . But if that does happen to you , we got solutions . There's so much we can do and you don't have to suffer in silence . Menopause is inevitable but suffering really is optional If you want to white knuckle your way through and give yourself a badge because you did it quote unquote naturally suffered through it . That's your choice . Like fine with you , but but if that scares you , you don't . You don't need to go down that route . It's . It's again we have . We have so many options , but leading , starting with everything that you talk about in terms of getting your nutrition dialed in and having exercise as part of your daily routine , are so foundational for having a smooth transition . It's not a guarantee , but it should be smoother when you have those things in place , as well as maybe sleep and your stress management and all that stuff , because they do impact your menopause journey .

Philip Pape 32:51

Yeah , all of that's important , and I think of the phrase minimum effective dose when you talk about like white knuckling it through , doing it only naturally , which I've definitely met people who are like I don't

Mobility and Floor Living

Philip Pape 33:01

want to do this , I don't want to take anything , I don't want to do this , I don't want to take anything , I don't want to take HRT , I don't you know , and I'm like , okay , you're potentially limiting yourself and others who want to try everything , and they don't approach it with a scientific method of like isolating the variables , right , and so then you don't know what's working , and so the middle ground seems to be you know foundation and then see what's there and then take one step at a time and start pushing the lever . So , given that you're like the biohacking expert and we're talking about preparing early , what's something , let's say , in your 20s as a woman , you should biohack or do besides what we've already talked about . That will set you up for more success than most women have knowing . Menopause is coming .

Zora Benhamou 33:39

Yeah , okay , yeah , first , definitely get your testing done and definitely understanding your periods that's just foundational . And then getting those , understanding how your body reacts to food and what foods are actually nourishing yourself right To give you energy , to make you feel good this is really , really important . And not being under-fueled or over-fueled , right , you don't want to have too much body fat and you don't want to have too little , because both of those set you up for possible early menopause . Okay , we want to be at a healthy body weight and so having that and again , exercise is a big component of that too . So getting in your strength training is so foundational .

Zora Benhamou 34:24

I talk a lot about sarcopenia as a gerontologist and this is the age-related muscle loss , but no age-related , sorry . There's things we can do . We're not using our muscles and without our hormones it can be . Versus when we have them , it can be a little harder to build muscle . So having building that now is so vital . I honestly think that part of my really good muscle mass . But I've been training and exercising since I was born , like I was just running around like it was doing the Jane Fonda thing when I was a teenager and I always liked exercise and I think it's really saved me in so many ways . Yes , things have happened to me in the last several years where I go . Thank God I've had good muscle and muscle has memory as well .

Zora Benhamou 35:21

So when you and you're building these muscle fibers when you're young and the same thing goes for bone they're so important you may not think about it . When you're young . All you're thinking about is I just want to grow and maybe , if you're little , you just want to become Superman . But you will need those muscles and you will need those bones , especially as we're getting into our sixties and seventies and eighties , because it's going to be a lifesaver to keep us independent , to help us recover from a fall without getting a fracture , and there's things that are really bad things that happen with that . So we want to keep that .

Zora Benhamou 35:55

So I would say , as you're young , please get you know and I don't want to say you'd have to be a bodybuilder but just get good muscle mass and protect your bones , and those are really really key . And again , you may struggle with that and I've had people who tell me in my community is like they've increased their muscle mass and they're boiling it all down to sleep . It's because I really focused on my sleep when growth hormone is released . So sleep is a big factor and I know we can get away with sleepless nights when we're young and pull all-nighters and all that . But again , you want to keep things in balance . Especially if you're having symptoms or if you're starting to feel like I really need my sleep , then make it a priority . And then , of course , the stress component , because that affects the hormone cortisol and that can affect a lot of other things that are going on in our . Then make it a priority .

Philip Pape 36:49

And then , of course , the stress component , because that affects that's the hormone cortisol , and that can affect a lot of other things that are going on in our body . You know we've talked about a concept called upward spiraling , which is when you can get one of these things improved that you just talked about . They make the others easier . And it's funny you mentioned sleep because there's a joke , like with menopausal women that I've noticed . It's you know they'll say well , what do I do ? And some 20 year old , you know , influencer guy would be like you need to get more sleep . And they're like well , I have trouble sleeping because I'm in menopause . Well , you just need more sleep .

Philip Pape 37:11

You know , and it's like this , like circular thing , and I've seen that I'm like I can't just tell people get more sleep or get better sleep , but if you're not lifting , if you're not moving , if you're not eating , well , that's also going to affect your sleep and your sleep's going to affect those . Right , it's a systematic thing . So it's a spiral of like where's your low hanging fruit ? Now , you know I've had clients who they've lifted for 20 years . That's not their concern . Their concern is they don't move throughout the day . They go and they lift three , four days a week , and then they don't move all day and they have 3000 steps . Well , all of a sudden their blood flows low , their resting heart rate's high , their insulin sensitivity is not great , and then they just start walking more and all of that gets better and now they start sleeping better , right ?

Philip Pape 37:54

So I'm playing off what you're saying , because when you're younger , listening to this , don't wait . And if you haven't done it and you're in your fort , yeah . So I want to ask you about the food and the healthy body weight part , because that could get misunderstood a lot . You talked about being overweight or potentially underweight , and overfueling or underfueling . I assume there's a fat-free mass component to that . Right , like , if somebody has good body composition , maybe that's less of a concern . What does the research say or what do you know about that ?

Zora Benhamou 38:31

In terms of I'm not sure I I'm sorry In terms of body weight and its impact on early menopause .

Philip Pape 38:37

That's what I mean .

Zora Benhamou 38:37

Oh , okay , yeah , no body weight , yeah . So I hate weight , I hate looking at a scale . To me it just doesn't mean anything . If anybody gets on a scale , I say I want to know your muscle mass , I want to know how much fat mass you have . So I think those are much better markers to look at . And then of course , you have the woman who's just like it , disrupts her day and she shouldn't be on a scale and she doesn't like it . And you know , sometimes we remove those things altogether .

Zora Benhamou 39:05

But in terms of , if you want to look at weight , what the research is showing in terms of menopause , if you are underweight you are more likely to have an earlier menopause . The weird thing is that there's some research coming out that shows if you're obese like a BMI over 30 , you're more likely to have a later menopause and delayed menopause , at least I think , is actually a good thing . We want ovarian function as long as we possibly can , and there's one study that showed obese women who had obese women , again over 30 BMI , they had 50% higher odds of menopause after the age of 52 and 53 , 52 , 53 . And the average age right now in North America is 51 . So it's okay . It's delayed by a couple years , but you go . Well , that's to me . It's not a reason to like you know it's not a good trade-off yeah , focus on that .

Zora Benhamou 40:04

It was just an interesting study . I thought , okay , I don't like that , but you know , but it's probably has a lot to do because there's your , your fat cells have a lot of estrogen , right . So when it's the loss of estrogen that causes the , at least the we , that's when we have the menopause . So if you can still have some hanging around , I'm not saying if you're obese forever , you'll always have estrogen and you'll always have , like , be menopause free , but but it tends to delay menopause .

Philip Pape 40:32

Yeah , it's interesting I didn't that that's a good explanation for the mechanism , cause I was like is it because your reproductive health is supported because you have more fat ? You know , despite the trade-offs of being more overweight , you can , you know you're in a better condition physiologically to have a , have a child and support the child because you have more fat stores . I don't know Right Like yeah . Yeah , but the estrogen makes a lot of sense .

Jorge 41:00

Hello everyone . My name is Jorge and I just kind of want to share a little bit about my experience with Wits and Weights . So I've been blown away from day one . Honestly , the best thing about Wits and Weights University is that Coach Philip has everything that we need all in one place . It's easy to follow , it's easy to understand . It even gives you like an introduction course at the beginning so you can know exactly what to do . It kind of made me very conscious of my nutrition and it's kind of set me in the right path , in the right direction . So , honestly , I could not recommend it enough . One of the best things is that whenever you have any type of question , it's answered within 15 , 30 minutes . You feel welcome , you feel good and like somebody's helping you . Everything you need is there . All you have to do is basically come and join us . See you there .

Philip Pape 41:44

And then you said you talked about sarcopenia , which is super relevant topic on this show for sure , and you and I talked last time how Megan Dahlman was on the show and mentioned the term osteosarcopenia and how they're linked together . Is there anything okay besides like lifting weights and moving ? Is there anything in your world of gerontology that you see people could be doing better or more of in their 20s and 30s ?

Zora Benhamou 42:06

Yeah , I would say it's shocking how many people have lost flexibility , mobility and agility in their 20s and 30s . It's like , wait , you look at a baby or a young child . They do a perfect squat and they can do so many things and they're flexible . And what happened right ? And we blame it on these chairs that we're sitting on very often . If you've ever been , have you been to Japan Once ? Yeah , I was lucky to go to Japan . Yeah , so you've ever been ?

Philip Pape 42:33

have you been to japan once ? Yeah , I was lucky to go to japan , yeah so you've the toilet sat .

Zora Benhamou 42:38

No , sat on the floor , I was gonna say that the holes in the floor toilets yeah , the squatty potty , like anyway .

Philip Pape 42:44

Yeah , the holes in the floor yes , you eat on the floor , that's true , you sit on the floor .

Zora Benhamou 42:47

The the holes . No . Japanese toilets are more known for their high tech that is true too and warm seats and stuff . It's more , I would say China , where you get the holes in the ground .

Philip Pape 43:01

I mean , look , I went in 2002 , so it was a long time ago . Oh , okay , and they actually had some of those , but you're right , mostly they had the seat warming and the LEDs and all that stuff .

Zora Benhamou 43:11

Yeah , yeah , it's funny , but Japanese people you take off your shoes when you get in the LEDs and all that stuff . Yeah , yeah , it's funny . But Japanese people , you take off your shoes when you get in the house and then you have eat on the floor , everything's on the floor . You sleep on a tatami right the like the futon imagine , I guess . I guess we would say in America , yes , where you have just it's like mattress on the floor and so you're constantly having to get up , get down , squat and you're just always have this movement . So you don't seem to lose that mobility and agility and flexibility . But in our Western world we have couches and chairs and beds that are high , so we don't need to squat so much anymore . So I think if you could work on that and keep it for the rest of your life , you're going to be really , really lucky .

Zora Benhamou 43:58

And I think that agility piece is really important because if you look at some older adults not everyone that maybe there's shuffle walking and they're just afraid to take a step because in case they fall and they haven't practiced fall prevention . We should be all practicing fall prevention like , like a stuntman , right ? You just learn how to do a little roll in case you fall , like . This is fun and you don't have to call it fall prevention , because I'm protecting my 70 year old self , but but these are really important . We don't understand until we lose it .

Zora Benhamou 44:30

And and I mentioned to you earlier that I had osteoarthritis I was living in the body of an 80-year-old . I know what it's like to shuffle , walk and to be afraid to go take a step off the curb . It's horrible , it's horrible , and I got a glimpse of what that's like and since I've had my hip replacements , I'm like thank goodness , but I don't ever want to be like that and I don't recommend it to anyone else . So please work . I know mobility classes now sound boring or not cool , but honestly , they should be a part of your weekly workout , in my opinion , if you want to talk about your future self if you want to talk about your future self .

Philip Pape 45:14

Yeah , you make a really good point , right , because I'm in a world where there's people like to lift but sometimes , just like that person I mentioned , sits around all day right With his job and gets stiff . I know men and women who they start lifting , maybe they walk , but they're not doing this other component and I like to think of it as , like you know , doing something fun and making that part of your routine if you can , for mobility , whether it is mobility stuff like yoga or stretching , but also sports , maybe you know pickleball , like all of that . Being being agile , calisthenics , playing with your kids , like if you've got kids , why aren't you playing with them and going outside and playing , come on , like just don't you know , and yeah , we do kind of lose that , and then you get stiff , right , you get more chance of connective tissue issues . You get the surgery . I mean I've had rotator cuff surgery and back surgery . You talk about your hip replacement . I'm like one day I feel like I'm going to need that .

Philip Pape 46:03

But I'm also trying to stay a little more active . Do some sprinting , do this and that Maybe not as much as I see some of my 25-year-old peers doing . I'm a little bit jealous . I'm like man , they're like playing basketball all the time , but I am a parent too , right ? So you've got mothers who are parents taking care of their kids . Maybe they've got a 50 hour a week job or whatever . What's your practical favorites when it comes to that ?

Zora Benhamou 46:24

Oh , yes , I practice this all the time and I've got to figure out another way , actually , because I do my podcasts doing this . But I would say , try to live on the floor and make your floor comfortable , right ? You can see , here in the back I have a rug and I have a low coffee table . I will put my computer on the coffee table and I sit with my like an Indian style or and then I have to . Oh , I got to go to the toilet , so I got to get up . So then I would say , let me try to get up without my hands . Let's try to just get up without putting too many hands on the floor .

Zora Benhamou 47:01

I eat on the floor , I go , and now it's , it's lovely , it's summer , I'll go in the garden , I'll eat on the grass , I'm getting some grounding , I'm getting outdoors , I'm getting fresh air , and I have to squat and I have to stand up again and again . Try to hold your plate with two hands and do it without getting off the floor , without using your hands . You can try to do these things in every single moment of the day that you can , and I think it's fun and maybe people will go . You look ridiculous , but I don't care , I'm going to be the one laughing when I'm 70 , you know , if I'm lucky to get there right Assuming that I do so , I think it's it's a matter of , I would say , floor life .

Zora Benhamou 47:46

Try to get on the floor as much as you can . Work on the floor , eat on the floor , play with your kids on the floor in the when the guests come . If you have guests , I'm on the floor . I sort of like tea , like a japanese woman , like , yeah , you know , I'm on my knees and we , why don't you sit on the couch ? I'm like , I just like being on the floor and actually that's quite natural for me

Exercise and Blood Sugar Management

Zora Benhamou 48:02

. I've always been like that , without even thinking about my future self . I've just been very I don't know , I guess grounded no , that sounds like you're mistake .

Philip Pape 48:10

Proofing the process is the way I would put it , my geeky sort of way . It's like you're biohacking the process because by being on the floor you have to interrupt constantly that pattern with movement right , whereas when you're sitting you can get hunched over for four hours in a row and not move right , even if you want to . You'd have to have reminders you have to do this and that You're making it where it just naturally is part of your life .

Zora Benhamou 48:36

It's like the flow . Yeah , actually , if you're sitting cross-legged , there's a time you're like , oof , yeah , I gotta stretch my legs . Then you stretch out the legs and then you're like , oh well , I'm here , I'll just do an extra stretch and you're there anyways . So you just think about it . Another thing I do is I have toys usually all over the floor , like like a ball for my foot . You know , I rub the ball , you know the little bounce the points . Yeah , so you can rub your foot , you massage your foot . Oh yeah , like the little .

Philip Pape 49:03

yeah , I got it . Yeah , sure , Sure .

Zora Benhamou 49:05

Yeah , and I just have just bands , because if I trip over it I go oh yeah , I could do this , and it's there and you can take like 30 seconds a minute and it adds up .

Zora Benhamou 49:18

And one thing I learned just recently and it totally inspired me yesterday I had an interview with Dr Marie Snyder and she has a podcast as well and we were talking about the blood glucose monitor challenge because I'm just finishing mine , were talking about the blood glucose monitor challenge because I'm just finishing mine , and she was saying you know what ? I concluded with blood sugar , which is another thing please , like , get your blood sugar . That's another great test to do . I'm such a fan of these . These are little devices . It's a sensor that you put in the back of your arm . It's a continuous blood glucose monitor and you have an app on your phone and you can see how your blood sugar rises and falls with the foods that you eat , the exercise , the stress , the sleep , how this all impacts . Blood sugar is a very important marker to understand your health and it's a way to delay aging , to have your blood sugar levels stable . It lowers inflammation and so many other things . And so she said , I said you know what ? I tried berberine , I tried apple cider vinegar , I've tried eating vegetables before you eat certain foods that can increase your blood sugar . Let's say a banana and bananas . I love bananas , I eat them . But I noticed , wow , it goes really high and then it just like boom , it like drops .

Zora Benhamou 50:30

So I had the best impact was exercising after I eat the piece of fruit or chocolate or whatever it is . That would spike my blood sugar and I thought , god , that's amazing . So she said you know what I do ? I got small kids . I can't run , I mean I can't go to the gym , so I do air squats right after I eat it . So she does just three minutes , just do 20 for one minute , another 20 for another minute , more or less . No , she does 60 . Yeah , 20 , 20 and 20 . That's what she does Every minute . She does 20 , 20 squats and then she does it for three minutes . Because we all got three minutes and I tested that twice . Totally , I drank grapefruit juice , which should have , should have like gone through the roof and it was just so stable ?

Zora Benhamou 51:21

I'm like no way . So exercise is such a powerful tool it's magic . Yeah , it's like so many ways and it's free , like I don't need to spend money on another supplement so so , yeah , that that's . That's another air squats she . So what she does is kind of crazy . She does that six times a day okay so she does 360 squats a day .

Zora Benhamou 51:43

I'm like whoa , that's a lot , but she's like I just sometimes I just take a break from my kids and you know we just we all do air squats together as a family and she incorporates this into her day and she's like this is brilliant , brilliant idea .

Philip Pape 51:58

Has she compared it to ? Has she compared it to like walking ? I'm curious .

Zora Benhamou 52:02

In terms of the blood sugar levels ? Yeah , yeah . Well she did . One day she told me that she ate a piece of cake Like she said . It was the most horrible piece of cake like you buy in the supermarket .

Philip Pape 52:13

The highly sugary grainy like it's all sugar , right yeah .

Zora Benhamou 52:16

Yeah , it was a Saturday . I was in the park with my husband and my son and I , and after that we went for a bike ride . So I wanted to go on a bike ride . So she went for two hours on the bike and she looked at a monitor didn't even blip .

Philip Pape 52:31

That's interesting , isn't that crazy ? Crazy , is it the bike ? But then walking compared to biking .

Zora Benhamou 52:34

I wonder , I don't know , the walking compared to biking , but for me walking definitely lowers the spike , for sure , for sure . I would go for about 20 minutes , 20 or 30 minute walk and it's so much it . If it's watermelon that really increases me , it'll . It'll still have a bump , but not not nearly as what it was before , with just a walk . It was within the range definitely .

Philip Pape 52:57

Yeah . So again you're just reinforcing the idea that being active , moving , taking care of yourself , eating foods you love , that nourish , you are all really great foundations if you wanna be ready for menopause and beyond . And then of course you can isolate the other things right and see okay , maybe it is thyroid , maybe it is progesterone or something like that . As we wrap up , is there anything else that someone , maybe in their thirties , maybe getting toward perimenopause in their forties , should know ? That we didn't cover .

Zora Benhamou 53:26

Oh God , there's a lot . Where should I start ? Yeah , and I'm trying to think I would say don't be afraid , Even if you're seeing all those horrible videos and those horrible reels .

Philip Pape 53:39

Good point . Don't do the fragility narrative Like . Don't adopt the fragility narrative . Right Of menopause .

Zora Benhamou 53:44

Yeah , For menopause as well

Breaking the Fragility Narrative

Zora Benhamou 53:47

as aging . I see a lot of younger people terrified of aging , Like they're like all biohacking in their twenties . I'm like I understand , like why I'm biohacking , because I can see the wrinkles . I can see like you can start seeing the degeneration , but in your twenties you're like full of collagen , Like why would you like in hormones , Like ? But they're concerned and I think they're concerned because of ageist , stereotypes and it's what we see . We're all ageist . There's plenty of research that goes and looks at all of these countries of the world and everyone's ageist . Some are more , some are less , and ageist . You know meaning . You just have a you . Yeah , you have a negative association .

Philip Pape 54:27

Bias against older age yeah .

Zora Benhamou 54:29

Right so , but there are countries that are better , like Japan , for example , is more accepted . People aren't so afraid . But we want to disrupt those just these ages stereotypes , because we have a menu of choice on how to age . We of course the the the horror stories are there . There are people who are sick , there are people who are frail or people who are getting fractures , or people who are dying , people who are really struggling the last 30 years of life on medication and doctors and all that . But that's just one choice . We have a choice .

Zora Benhamou 55:02

We can do things to age healthily and the way we want to . We have to be proactive . We have to look for our future selves and when you think about dementia and cardiovascular disease and osteoporosis , these aren't diseases that start at age 70 or 65 . They start in your 30s , 40s , 50s and we don't feel them . They're called silent killers because we don't feel our bones getting brittle or we don't feel our arteries getting full of plaque . We only notice it when we're already there , and then it's kind of late and it's a good thing .

Zora Benhamou 55:41

I really strongly recommend people to consider prevention . I know it's not sexy , but everything that you're doing now in your 20s and 30s and 40s is really going to protect your future self , and it gets easier . You may think , oh , it's job right now . To get it sorted out . Yeah , maybe hard in the beginning , but after a while it becomes a habit and it becomes a lifestyle and you don't even think about it anymore and you just don't want to live any other way because it's just quite normal for you , because you feel so good . So really don't be afraid of aging . And again , we have choices . We can do whatever we want and when it comes to aesthetics , if you want to go gray , fabulous . If you want to dye your hair fabulous . Do you Do what makes you happy . We can A lot of things that we can to be the way that we want , to look and feel as good as we want .

Philip Pape 56:29

Oh , I love that message right , because being happy and having well-being starts now and , like you said , it gets easier . You've got to take the steps and some of it is uncomfortable or different , like working out if you don't do it . But , trust me , when you're 40 , when you the surface , so folks can definitely find you on your podcast Hack my Age , and you're also going to be in Physique University as a guest speaker doing a live Q&A . That's on September 23rd , so if you're hearing this before then , you could always jump in before that to catch Laura for a live Q&A with her . Where do you want folks to find you after hearing this amazing podcast ?

Zora Benhamou 57:12

Wherever they go , I am there , whether it's Facebook , Instagram , TikTok , LinkedIn X , I've everywhere . I've got podcasts , but the easiest thing is just go to hackmyagecom , because I'll have all the links to all of whatever area that you put yourself into , I will be there and you can reach out . I'm still reachable . You know , send me a message . If I don't see it right away , I will be there and you can reach out . I'm still reachable . Send me a message . If I don't see it right away , I'll . Eventually we'll see it .

Philip Pape 57:38

Beautiful Hackmyagecom . You can find Zora everywhere . She's awesome . She will respond to you and thank you so much , Zora , for coming on the show to talk about a very important topic . It's a pleasure .

Zora Benhamou 57:48

Thanks for having me .